0:00 Hey, welcome to today's episode of habits Podcast. Today I have a special guest, Josh Lawler. We are going to do a brief introduction on him real quick. Welcome to today's episode, I hope you stay tuned for the mix and see what we're talking about today. So Josh, where we talk, where are you from? What country are you from today? And let's meet you. 0:22 Yeah, good. Good to be here. Good to be on. I'm in the I'm in the Northeast. So I'm outside of New York City. So yeah, but 45 minutes outside of the city. 0:32 I've only been to New York once. And I used to be a truck driver. So I was traveling through New York. And I was like, my GPS like, oh, go through New York City. I'm like, have been in New York City. Let me do it. I ended up paying like $114 toll, and then ended up taking a wrong road. That was cars only trying to get back to the little free was going around the city. Yeah, that was my experience with New York City. 0:59 Yeah, I don't recommend I don't recommend driving a truck through New York City. It can be it can be challenging. Even. I remember, you know, actually living in the city when I was younger, and, you know, moving. I remember I was helping a friend moved once and we had a moving truck that we were driving and we were parking it but the street happened to be on a fire engine route thoroughfare. And so like every 20 minutes, a fire truck came by and one of us have to run down, move the truck drive around the block. So yeah, not easy, not easy city for trucks. 1:28 That is sounds like a nightmare. I think moving in general just scares me and then moving into big city. Just I don't know, that doesn't sound fun at all. I think the no parking thing annoys me. 1:39 Parking, parking is challenging. And that's why that's why we moved out. Years years ago. So yep. 1:46 That's funny. Let's, let's see a little ways of rates in the city, you still get the advantage of the city, but you're not in the city. That's right. That's right. He's got to deal with the traffic whenever you want to go. Exactly. Let's talk a little bit what you do. I want I want to start this interview, because I think you have a very unique niche. And I love hearing stories and different strategies about real estate. Just because there's so many, like vast strategies, and I think is one of the big reasons why I love talking. I love podcasting. In general, anyways, because there's a million strategies out there. And I love talking to people that have their own strategy. So can you tell people a little bit what you do? And how you do is to kind of jump into that? 2:28 Yeah, sure. So you know, before, before we get into the kind of the real estate niche that I think we're gonna be talking about more, I'll talk a little bit about my background in real estate, yeah, set set that set the scene a little bit, a little bit of a little bit of context. So I think, you know, like, like, a lot of people were sort of working kind of office office jobs, sort of always looking for ways to ways to get out, you know, develop paths build up passive income, and of course, kind of stumbled into stumbled into real estate. But the first the first experience in real estate was actually what I would call a long term live in flip. So you know, this is kind of going going way back, just after the financial crisis of 2008. So I wish I could take credit for being smart about buying at that time, but it was simply just we're having a baby and needed to needed more space, it just, you know, timing worked out. And so my wife and I, we bought a house moved outside of the city, and we bought kind of the you know, the classic, ugliest house on the block, right? Like this thing was a nice neighborhood. But you know, kitchen was a time capsule to 1984 you know, very, very dated very old, we knew that we would do some work on it, try to try to add some value, you know, but it took us it took us a couple years and speaking of speaking of trucks by the way so interesting story on this, this renovation so after living there for a couple years, we decided to do a gut renovation and addition it was kind of a strangely configured in addition to the really old kitchen and kind of dated everything. And so I actually had a brother in law in Canada who worked in kind of condo condo development, so he had access to materials got at better pricing than than we could get. And so kind of budgets, we're definitely looking at the bottom line and the budget. So we actually ended up ordering all of our kitchen cabinets and all of our hardwood flooring, sort of getting it through sort of that cost from my brother in law, which meant though, that I would have to drive a big truck to bring everything to bring everything down. And so definitely an interesting you know, you'll learn a lot about the sort of the manifest and the paperwork that you need to you know, kind of you're essentially treated as like as like an importer to cross the border in a truck. But the benefit was I was able to go through the truck lane, which was super fast and so I didn't have to wait at the at the border at all coming, coming back. So don't be with fraid to go far afield for you know, you might get might be where the better deal is. And you can kind of say, say there, 5:06 how force is right for you? Because I know New York is, depending on what part of the New York can be really close to the borders right there. 5:11 Yeah. Well, I mean, because we're closer to New York City, and this is going up into the Toronto area, probably about a normal like, in good conditions about an eight hour drive. So this was, yeah, a lengthy, lengthy drive, but we loaded the load the truck up and, and drove it back. And, yeah, now got a great, great deal on material. So 5:31 no, you got to be resourceful. Sometimes, I credit you for that. And then I think a lot of people would be dancing. I don't want to cross the border. That sounds like a whole headache. 5:40 Yeah. So So anyway, did that, you know, ended up we renovated, did in addition, lived in the house for another, you know, another couple of years. And then that actually is we created a lot of value when we did that got renovation and addition. And so through by doing that, we were able to create a lot of equity, you know, did a got a home equity line of credit. And that was actually what we use to start investing in single family rentals. And we actually invested in the started not locally near where we are, but instead, we went down to the southeast. So the Atlanta region, the Jacksonville, and this is now about 2016 or so, and picked up a few single family rentals. You know, I was I was new I was I was nervous about kind of like, you know, making the wrong investment or losing money. But we actually worked through a, at the time, it was a startup company called roofstock, which is kind of a turnkey turnkey. Yeah. So great. 6:56 Was that were huge? No, right. roofstock. Yeah, 6:58 they had grown, but back, then they were trying to kind of just starting out. So we sort of took a chance with them. But what I liked was that they put together all of the due diligence and kind of sort of inspections. And it really kind of gave me more of a comfort level in terms of what what I was investing in. And they connected us with, of course, property management that they had vetted, etc. And so, yeah, that was really the kind of the entry into so we purchased long distance in the kind of work through a property manager. And it's funny when I was when we were first looking at these, my wife and I, we were kind of running the numbers and you know, looking at the monthly cash flow, and focused on that, but what's really benefited us over the years is just, you know, the appreciation, and especially in these markets, where, you know, values have have gone up quite a bit, all of those properties that we purchased have, you know, more than more than doubled in price, since we we purchased them. So yeah, so you know, kind of did the single family, we still we still have those along the way, we picked up some multifamily, some small, what I call small multifamily two to four unit apartments in, in kind of a little bit a little bit closer to home. And, again, just kind of trying trying every different areas of real estate seeing, seeing how they how they did you know, it's been interesting, some have been more successful than others, right. And the cash flow is never never as like it pencils out, you know, when you're doing the when you're doing the math after you deal with repairs, and maintenance and things like that. But like I said, the single family homes did, you know did did pretty well created a lot of equity again, and were able to, you know, we cash out refi those couple times, actually. And we ended up selling our primary home and actually moving and doing another kind of fixer upper, just like we had done before. And that's in the current the current home that I'm in now. And that kind of brings us to when we started doing sort of getting into the renting for film shoots, which is so again, I give you a lot of background there because it's not like you know, we jumped right in and started doing film shoot rentals, we kind of went through a lot of the traditional aspects of real estate investing. I think a lot of people do single family rentals, you know, you live in flip, you know, small multifamily, etc. So 9:26 I think everybody has their path and there's almost like an epiphany that happens. You're like, hey, let's let you kind of hear about it or kind of kind of fall into it and like, oh, let's try it and that works out great. And then like, it was like real estate's passive income and you realize you got to do repairs, and they can see six months and you're like, oh, no, it's not so passive anymore. 9:47 Yep, absolutely. So, 9:50 Dumpster Rentals. Like what was like the initial bug like it wasn't like, like somebody like jumped on your lap like ah, check this out, or was it like one of the things we're like Hey, let's try this thing out. Oh, yes. So someone had, 10:04 you know, we're talking to someone, and so on and sort of mentioned it right and just kind of like, planted the seed that it was a thing. You know, like we didn't even we didn't even know it was we didn't even know it was a thing. And, you know, we had just sort of renovated and rebuilt the current the current house. And so we figured, I figured, you know what, let's, let's try this, let's get some pictures. Because the pictures taken and let's sort of try to see if we can figure this out. And, you know, obviously, I've learned a lot along the way, you know, made a made a lot of mistakes. But, you know, I think it's, it's one of those niches of real estate that just, it's not very well known. And I think that there are a lot of misconceptions about it. So whenever I talk to people about it, they often kind of come up with immediately, like a number of myths or sort of misconceptions about it that I think are probably worth worth talking through for people. So Daniel, what's your first thought when you think of film crew rentals? You know, what's kind of like the first thing that you think you need to have to make it work. 11:14 So, the reason why it caught my eye because I a sliver, I lived in Atlanta for six years, six and a half years a long time. And Atlanta is a big film film area. There was an investor that I followed his day on Facebook, I've never spoken to him. I've reached out to him never connected. His name is Jay Crawford. You're watching this monitor the podcast. But I've watched him for a while and he was building like these new builds. And he eventually, people started connecting with him like he was building them to sell. But like, he's people like, Oh, can I film? Music Video your house? Yep. I remember his first post years ago was probably two or three years ago. And he's like, sure, like how much of my how much we talking about. So he started posting his little journey of like, people will ask him to, like he had like two or three music videos from this house. And then his videos came out. And he's putting the video on where his house was. So it was it was a really cool experience, seeing his house on music videos. So after I saw that, and then he said people would book it for like, private dinners or something. Like this is like, this is like I feel like it's like a slap not every because no one's staying. There's more for like, activity rentals of like peerspace or something like that. Almost like that type of rental. But it was a little different. Because he was making a lot of money charging for the for the, like people blocking for like five hours. And he charged him like 1015 grand on 12:45 this. And it sounds like he's got a very nice house. But so you told me I haven't haven't seen it. But yeah, you said a couple of things there that are worth I think diving into. So we've also done music videos. That's not my kind of first recommendation. And we can we can get into that. But you know, the other thing you said is you I thought you were going to bring up LA but you brought up Atlanta, which is like you said it's another kind of it's actually a pretty big hub for for the film for the film industry. But, you know, one of the top misconceptions that people have when they when they hear film shoots is oh, I've got a, I've got to be near La, right, like I got to be near Hollywood. But when we say film shoots, and you kind of touched on it right with a few different things talked about music videos, and you mentioned meetings, but what I would, what I would bring up is that most of the shoots that we do are commercial shoots. So when we're you know, most people think of feature films and like these huge productions, but what we're really talking about is one day, commercial shoots either video or you know, still photography. These are, you know, businesses, companies, startups that need to create content. And you think about it, startups, businesses, any kind of companies, they exist all across the country, and internationally, not to mention outside outside of the US as well. And, you know, everyone has a website that they need to keep up to date. Everyone has social media that there they need to create content for. So, you know, there's a need for locations to film and create this content and all across the country, wherever, wherever there are businesses. So I think, you know, the first myth is that you can do this anywhere, you don't have to be near a big city, you don't have to be near La. And so I think that's, it's kind of important to sort of something important to say. I think the other piece is, you know, the next thing that people typically think about is they think, you know, I need to live in an amazing house for this to work you know, I need to be on some like ocean front mansion and and look, you know, sure there are shoots that you know, look for that and that's what they're looking for. But most shoots are, you know, looking for Well, let me say this every shoot has a unique requirement and there Are for sort of every location requirement is is different. And it may be worth sort of sharing. I learned this early on, because we had a, we had an inquiry from a, it was an online platform that helped parents search for childcare for their, for their kids, they think they look for a babysitter or nanny or something like that. And they wanted to refresh their website content. And so they scheduled a scouting visit to come to check out the house and director came with the producer and a couple of members of the crew walked around, checked out the lighting. They said, Okay, you know, we've got a few other locations to look at, we'll give you a call in a couple of days. And they call me back and they said, Josh, you know, we really loved your house. But because we're you know, we have a site that caters to parents, little kids, we're looking for something that kind of looks like you've got like, rambunctious little kids like some, you know, we're looking for a little more clutter, a little more wear and tear something a little older. So you know, 16:04 and that in my house right now, like it's ready for you. 16:07 There you go. And so, you know, I think that just kind of like illustrates the point that, again, every shoot is different. And so sometimes in this case, you know, we had just renovated a house, they were looking for something that was like looked older, because that was like they just wanted it to look more realistic to a house with like a young family with like little little kids who were you know, going crazy. And just one more, there was another time when we actually had a unfortunately, we had this plumbing disaster. So we woke up and this is like after the newly renovated house, we've been there for like a year, came downstairs in the morning. And the entire first floor was flooded with water. So overnight, a water filter under the kitchen sink had like first, and water was just running like all night long. We ultimately had to demo the entire kitchen, replace all the wood flooring on the entire first floor, it was like back to construction, like even talking to ripping out ripped out all the cabinets, all the countertops, like everything had to be replaced. It was it was kind of crazy. But so so during this time, you know, this is like a months long repair. During this time, of course, I'm getting inquiries from potential shoots, and I'm having to like email back and say, Geez, I'm really sorry. I'm really sorry, like we had this thing will be well renovated. We'll be back in business in like three or four months. If you're, you know, still interested. Let's get in touch that. But this one inquiry said, Oh, that's okay. And then so it turns out that this shoot was for a startup that sold utility monitoring equipment. So when I say that think something like little devices that attach to like your electrical and your gas line and your water line to let you know if there's an issue. And so when they heard like we had this flood, they're like, oh, yeah, that's fine. And actually like, like, can we shoot in like the destroyed area of your house so we can show customers? What happens if you don't use our product. And so they came and did a shoot, like, they were in the basement, they were in like the under repair area. So you just you never know what the requirements of a shoot is going to be. And so that's why like, I always say like, kind of every house or apartment like there's a shoot for every house or apartment. And don't Don't worry that your house isn't some you know, like Architectural Digest like structure. 18:26 In my head. I would have been like yes, but I want a free sample. 18:31 Well, that's another benefit we've actually got case it's funny you say that because the last year we did was for water company like bottled water, not not like flooding water, but and there's some new line of college and water. Have you heard of this? Like they put collagen in the water? I mean, it's flavor. It's so it tastes good. And you're getting, there's always something in the water. There's always something vitamins. Now it's collagen. And so we've just got like, you know, they're like, Oh, you guys want some of this? We're like, Sure. So you know, just got we've probably got a lifetime supply now of college and college and water from from the most recent shoot. So yeah, anyway, those are just like some of the, let's see, I think we touched on like some of the some of the misconceptions that people have, you know, when they think about film shoots, 19:19 question I have is, there's really a marketplace for this where people are looking for certain houses. 19:25 Yeah, yeah. So there are a number of there are a number of platforms out there. I mean, you you yourself, you mentioned peerspace That's, that's one of them. And I think it Well, a couple ways. When I first started, you know, we thought that maybe we'd have to go through location scouts, right. These are kind of more like Lancers, we look for you know, the audience maybe doesn't know, they have a bunch of locations that they're aware of, and then they have a client who is doing a shoot and then they'll sort of connect the two. I actually that may work for some people. I actually recommend going through a platform like like like a Pearson case, there are, but whatever platform you use, there are a few things to keep in mind that you want to you want to look for that make a good platform. So, you know, the first thing is, you always want to check to see if the platform covers where you live. So, you know, some platforms are nationwide and even international, but others are very specific to certain areas, you don't want to, you don't want to waste your time, you know, putting up your home on a platform, if you're living in Texas, and the platform only, you know, handles, Florida, something like that. So that's one, I think you also want to check a platform to see if it is free to list. So a lot of platforms out there will gladly take your money to put up some pictures of your house. But and I've tried those, but in my experience, the platforms that are free to list are, you know, you get plenty of plenty of inquiries. And their business model is typically taking a percentage of the of the revenue from either you or the shoot. I think you know, something else to look for in a platform is pricing transparency, what I mean by that, I mean being able to actually list your, your fee, and we can kind of get into I think some of the some of the benefits of film shoot rental profitability versus maybe other areas of real estate and in a bit, but the pricing, transparency is super important. So this will a you know, just save you from wasted time. So there's nothing worse than you know, I've dealt with location scouts, you should invest time having conversation, maybe they come visit, and then you learn that, you know, the budget of the production is like half of what your you know, normal rate is and so you just kind of wasted your time. And so I think, you know, that's important to be able to set your rate. And I think also pricing flexibility is also very important. And what I mean by that is I mean, can you set different rates, depending on the shoot size. So there are some platforms that are a little bit more limited in how you can promote your your home, they might just offer, you know, one one daily rate, right. And that's better than, you know, no rate. But then what happens, I mean, there's a pretty big difference between a five person shoot and a 40 person shoot. And, you know, pro tip, you want to charge more for the for the bigger sheets, right. And so the platforms that allow you to set some tiered pricing, I think is important. And that's that's kind of an attribute that you want to look for. What else I think, schedule flexibility. So you know, the thing about film shoots is you want to really kind of do them when you want to write so you know, a platform that allows you to say, Okay, I only want to do shoots during the week, and I don't want to do any on the weekends, right, you can sort of set calendar calendar scheduling for availability is important. You know, setting a maximum size, we talked about, you know, kind of shoot sizes, like for me personally, you know, 4045 is probably the max like I don't want like 100 people sort of descending on my on my house, it couldn't fit that many people and it would be too disruptive. So you want to find a platform that's going to allow you to set a maximum number of people. You know, minimum number of hours is another thing that you want to look for, right. And we talked about to come back to the music video. So, you know, early on, we did a music video and I love music as much as anyone else. But I found that in my experience, musicians are their creative types, right? So they're not, you know, like the the ones that we had, they came, they showed up three hours late because they didn't account for traffic. And so then they had to, they had to stay late. And it typically doesn't take as long though to shoot a music video as like what I would call a professional commercial production. So like, typical productive commercial production is going to be like, usually 10 to 12 hours. So kind of like a full day. And those are the types of shoots that I try to attract. And there's some reasons for that. Obviously, kind of the the more hours that the higher the profitability, but there are some interesting tax benefits to of film shoots in terms of just optimizing the number of days per year that we can get into as well if any of your audience might be familiar with the Augusta rule and kind of how that works. 24:22 Okay, I do have a question. Okay. So you have your your property itself might be different size or different sizes. If you have multiple properties, you might charge based off the people and you might charge based off of what type of shoot it is. So there's different variables like kind of weight and size of the shoot. Yep. And all that. So how do you how do you like get that price transparency? Because I think there's a lot of different variables. Yeah, yeah. Weigh in there. 24:49 Yeah, no, pricing is how you price is definitely part part art part science. So when we first started we vastly underpriced Okay, and I know that big because, again, we had no idea, right? And so we said, Okay, we again, in our minds, we were kind of anchoring to that traditional, traditional real estate rental. And so just to, you know, kind of, maybe talk a little bit about, like, sort of what the potential profitability is here and how film shoots compare to, you know, long term rentals. I think if you have a typical, think of like a typical in a mid priced area of the country, like a three bedroom, two bath type house, you know, might rent for like, 1500 a month, right? Or 2000 a month on like, a 12 month lease, that same house, you know, if you Airbnb it, by the by the night, maybe you could get, you know, a couple 100 bucks a night, right? So you rent that out half the time, you're going to be more profitable than the long term rental film shoots, kind of take it to the next level, because your rate is charging by the hour. Okay, so that's kind of, as we talked about, and this is why, you know, I like to kind of optimize to do shoots that are going to and I set a minimum number of hours and want to optimize for the for the tax benefits we'll get into in a second. But back to your back to your question. So, you know, so my house currently, so when we first started, we listed our house for 300 an hour. Okay, and you know, we are in a, like I said, we're in the northeast, sort of outside of New York, so we're in a higher higher cost part of the country. Alright, so you know, like, everything that's going to prices are going to kind of cost to where they're gonna fluctuate. And we knew we underpriced it because we were immediately inundated with requests. So we were getting like, like, the emails are coming in from from the platform saying, like, Oh, hey, can I, you know, I want to do this, but I want to, you know, can we shoot, are you free on this day, but we were and we got a lot of actually a lot of music, video requests from people who just wanted to do one hour, two hours and look for anyone listening, I would recommend our minimum, right, like, you want to set your personnel you set like some minimum hours, and you'll you'll screen out what I'll call sort of problematic renters because and if you think and, again, from experience, you know, it takes at least an hour to set up, it takes at least an hour to tear down. So anyone who's telling you Oh, yeah, I only need one hour, two hours? I would my recommendation is to stay away from that. 27:17 So you do $300 an hour, three hour minimum. So if you're not going to leave the house for 900 bucks, you know, 27:23 well, we actually have a well, I mean, our minimum is actually, you know, six hours now. And our rate is now 600 an hour. So we landed on like 600 an hour. And because also we wanted to, you know, 27:38 target the right audience with the right yeah, so that'll 27:41 basically what that'll do is it'll screen out just like if anyone's been involved in you know, traditional real estate renting some time. If you have like, really low rent units, sometimes that attracts prob that can attract problematic tenants. I think it's the same thing with film shoots if you underprice. You know, if you say, oh, yeah, I'm gonna, sure you can come for just an hour, you're gonna get, you're gonna get, you know, what I'll call less professional renters, the kind of shoots that I like, or the very professional commercial, you know, these are like a, you know, it's got a profession, a professional producer, they're they're working with with a client, they're promoting a product, and it's like, a very well run machine. So I found that, you know, we It wasn't always like that we definitely had more, you know, when we first started, but we learned sort of raised our raised our price, you know, set the minimum number of hours that we allow, and what that also does is it limits the number of shoot days per year, you may be wondering, like, Oh, why do you want to limit the number of shoot days per year, you know, but for us, we're living in the house and look, you know, as great as film shoots are, I don't want to do them every day. Right? So there's a there's a happy medium, and I view it as a real complimentary niche of real estate to other areas investment as well. And there's so there's something that, you know, goes is called the Augusta rule for anyone not familiar with it. And this is, and again, I'm not a tax professional, always consult your tax advisor. But the Augusta rule says that and the history is the mass I think maybe in the 70s or so the Masters golf tournament in Augusta, Georgia, locals would rent out their homes to people visiting to come through the golf tournament, and they lobbied Congress to make a rule that said that they can rent for up to two weeks, 14 days without paying any taxes on the income. So that's a that's a pretty big benefit. And in real estate and for film, shoot rentals, especially is well suited to that because, you know, unlike you might have an Airbnb that you want to obviously rent out as much as you can, you're quickly going to exceed 14 days per year. But if it's your home that you're renting for film shoots, you can try to optimize to hit you know, just hit that 14 days per year number and again, if you minimize if you if you set those minimum hours, you can do pretty well and get 14 shoots and they will and all of the income will be tax free from those from those shoots. So you know, just to To kind of give you give you a sense, right? Like, in my house 600, we are ready to 600 per hour, you know, a professional day for a shoot 12 hour day, 7200 a day, times 14 days is about 100 grand, and we don't pay any taxes on that. So that's the equivalent of like, 150 grand, say before before tax. So, you know, again, that's why I recommend you want to kind of optimize professional professional crews, professional shoots, you know, minimum number of hours. And again, there's no if look, if you want to go for it or rent as many days as you can, you'll you'll be fine. But again, for me, it's personal. For me personally, I like to kind of find that medium one two shoots a month. That's that works nicely for me. 30:47 That is amazing. To make $100,000 tax free. Now. That's huge. That's huge. So the reason why I booked this interview is because we own me, my partner owned a house in Texas. It's a it's like a five bed nine bath. 31:05 Okay. 5400 square foot house. Big house. Okay. Texas, you say was in Texas, in Texas, a Texas sized house. Yeah. Okay. 31:14 It's a Texas sized house. And right now we just use as our office and people go in there maybe a couple hours a day and one part of the house and the rest of the house is just there. So like, whenever we do events or stumped comes, people come into town, they'll use it. Like I just went to Texas to do. We're doing well, actually, I should have passed through. I was doing a road trip. Okay, just passed through Texas. I stayed there a week in the house. So I'm like, it has its own little benefit. You know? So we're, we've been trying to find a way to monetize it, which is why it's good to send me because you're doing you're doing the thing. 31:47 Oh, this is this is perfect. And it's funny, because there have been other other podcast hosts who had like, similar similar situations where they had something else and they're like, oh, yeah, like we could be using this property for for film shoot rentals. And that's actually perfect. I mean, not perfect, but I'll say it's, it's almost even easier. Because if you're not living there, if you're if you're just using it for an office now, and by the way, another misconception that we didn't talk about before, you know, you choose which areas of the house you're going to allow for film shoots. So, you know, for me, we a couple of areas of our house are off limits. One my older daughter, right? Yeah. She just said, Nope, sorry. And if you have a teenager, you know, you can argue, so we said, Fine, okay, your your room is off limits. And the room I use for my home office is is off limits. So you know, if you're using his house as an office, that's fine, you know, you're you're gonna put your house up for for film shoots, you just don't show any pictures of the rooms that are off limits, right. And that's fine. And, by the way, you know, when I first started, I had some preconceptions of like, which areas that I was like, Ooh, or, you know, our kitchens. Nice. Like, that's what they're what they're gonna want to use. And, you know, I told the story of that utility monitoring company that like, you know, shot in our unfinished basement, but we've had inquiries for like, parts of the house that you just never would, would have thought of. So we had a roofing company that contacted us, and they just wanted to, like, take drone footage of our roof, right, like nothing inside, like just the outside. We also had a, there was a well known vodka company that wanted to do a tailgating scene, like in our driveway. Right? And so, you know, it's just yeah, you should totally look into it. They 33:34 really want for everybody hear that soliciting? Podcast hosts, they do stuff for their own benefit. So if you're listening to this, you just find them awesome. But this is Kashmir. Right? So it's really acknowledge that No, one thing I really like about this niche is that it doesn't really matter about the houses that people need. Just ABC house doesn't have a look at anything special for whatever they need it for. I think the roofing was a perfect example. Like, you just can't go to anybody house and film on their house. You just can't do that. Yeah. 34:08 Yeah. And I would also add that, you know, people may be wondering, like, Well, don't these, you know, why do these companies that are, you know, creating content for their website or a new product line? Like, why can't they just use a studio? And I've asked the same question. So I always ask, like, when the producers calm and the directors they like, so So why can't you guys just like, especially when it's a you know, like we had for some reason, like our house attracts companies that create, you know, like clothes or like products for like toddlers and babies. So we've had, you know, a number of shoots for that. And I always ask them, like, like, can you guys just film this at a studio? And they said, you know, there's something about a house that it just feels more real and authentic. So it's like, you know, the angles, the windows, 34:52 real lighting, yeah, lighting real windows, and then you can fake that, but it's a different aesthetic. And I think I think those reader directors, they understand that so they'd rather put it as much as possible into the actual real thing if the if they have the opportunity to Yeah, not simply came to the studio, but we created a studio from A to Z is probably going to cost more than seven grand. 35:13 Yeah, yeah. And I'll say to a couple of things. It's funny when you were telling me about this house that you and your partner had, I thought you were gonna go in a different direction. I thought you were gonna say like you rent it out for Airbnb because one of the things that like a lot of Airbnb investors are pretty fascinated by film shoot rentals. They've never heard of it. Because if you think about a typical Airbnb, those are rented on the weekends, right long weekends when people on a getaway right, like a Friday to a Monday, but film should rentals again, the professional ones, the approach that I that I teach in my course is the ones that you want to attract are typically during the week. And so it's a really nice complement for you know, if you're, if you're if you've got an Airbnb that you're renting out on the weekends, put up for film shoots, and you can start to fill those vacancies during the week, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, etc. So, 36:01 no, I like strategy. Now, do you are you providing like anything else? You just pretty much like give them the location? You tell them the off limits? I'm sure, like locked doors are you kind of give them like a layout? Like, I'm sure you have a packet when they come in like, Hey, these are off limits. These are like, you gotta have some of those like, processes. Even your house. Yeah, no, absolutely. Talk about that. Let's talk about like rules and regulations. I'm sure you have a packet you give everybody that comes in the house. 36:31 Yeah, so I definitely recommend, and I teach this as well, that you know, you want to you want to put together your house rules. That's definitely part of it. Right. Like, you know, you learn, you learn the hard way. So this music video that we did, you know, they bought these, you know, like the kind of flowers you buy it like a convenience store. It's like really cheap, like they're dyed red, I think you know, and so they were like throwing these flower petals, and they got all over the wood floor, it came out. But it was like you learn to you, you learn to have like a note, like a no glitter rule, you know, like stuff that's going to be hard to stuff, it's gonna be hard to clean. But I think in addition to the house rules, there's a lot of communication strategies and techniques that, you know, again, I talk about this a lot in the course that I run, but you really want to ensure that you're over communicating. So I've had the experience where, and just give an example, right? So if you if you agree on a shoot, that is going to run from 8am to 6pm. That's pretty typical, right? I mean, that's, that's a 10 hour, it's a 10 hour shoot pretty typical start time pretty typical end time, you would think that, that's pretty straightforward, right? 8am Start your show up at eight. It's not the case. So we've had, you know, I'll never forget the time that I was actually just getting out of the shower 6:30am I hear the hear the doorbell rang at 630 for an eight o'clock shoot. And it's kind of like, what do you guys do? And like, we're starting at 8am. And they're like, oh, yeah, well, we're not really going to start filming. We're just going to load in the equipment and get set up. So you know, to be clear on anyone thinking about doing this. You want to you're charging the entire time. Okay, like there's no like, the start time is when they can arrive and start setting up. So yeah. 38:28 Yeah. Like, yeah, so gotta pick the kids up, like, come on guy. 38:32 Exactly. So back to your question. Yeah, there are a lot of sort of templates that I follow that I've developed, in addition to the in addition to the house rules, just to make sure that and, and touch points kind of leading up to the shoot. So it really starts with kind of that first interaction and you're doing some there's a screening process that I've I've developed to kind of weed out local problematic, problematic renters, you only want to get kind of the top the top renters. And then once you've decided on it, yeah, it's that it's that communication. You know, and there are other techniques, even the day of the shoot for how you can make that run smoothly, by having some repeatable process in place. 39:14 Yeah, and that's why I always want to get down to the business of it, because everything should have a process, everything should have a system and whether the system you're using helps you with some of that you still need to have house rules, you still need to have a disposition process when they leave. If they trashed the house, there's going to be a fine in place. You gotta make sure you say that upfront. Like you gotta you gotta make sure you lay out a to z, everything that can will and might happen 39:38 that yeah, not Not to mention, you know, you need to be aware of any local regulations, right, that that you might be subject to. So and I will say like, people shouldn't be scared of of local regulations and I always recommend people to stay above board and follow any local regulations to which you're subject just most towns and municipalities, whether you're in a city or a suburb or a small town, most municipalities have some kind of filming policy. Okay. So, you know, it's just a matter of finding what that policy is, you know, maybe you need a permit, don't be scared of needing a permit, any professional crew that you're working with will be used to having to obtain a permit from your local municipality. If if they kind of balk at that permit requirement, that's a red flag, and I would recommend passing so you know, certainly, you know, again, you don't want to accept every single crew that's interested in renting from you. So yeah, 40:38 I one thing I'll ever hear is when you act aboveboard, you can recognize people that don't. Exactly, exactly. So I think I think that's a great little caveat to that is, if you if you if you know, the rules and act accordingly, you can tell who's not one of the things I really like it, it's just the I feel like you've probably learned a lot about filming and professionalism on that side of it. Because it's a whole new business. It's not even real estate, you're not even the real estate business, per se. Yeah. Film Industry business. And I think, yeah, there's a learning curve to learning that industry in itself, of how people operate. 41:11 Yeah, I mean, it's certainly certainly have I will say that, and thanks for bringing that up, because I didn't mention it earlier. But that's something else. That is another common misconception. Sometimes people say like, oh, like, I don't know anything about like, the film, I don't know anything about the film industry, like, how can I do this? And, and look, let me be clear, when producers or directors are looking at your location for a shoot, they're not looking at your skills as a filmmaker, or any aspect, they're simply looking at your location. And so if your location if your house or your apartment meets the requirements, they're, they're happy. You know, the one thing I will say is, I think you're going to kind of maybe maybe related to this. So you know, like, you don't need to know anything about the film industry, I have, obviously absorbed from, you know, kind of some of the the lingo or like some of the, like, seeing how it, seeing how it works, and you know, what they what they call things, but I think the key thing is, is just like allowing the shoot to you need to be comfortable allowing the shoot to run its course. So, you know, in, in the course that I teach, actually interview a producer, too. And we kind of have a discussion about, you know, how you can be a good host, like from the perspective of a producer. And it was interesting, this woman, like she's done shoots at my house before with her production company. And, you know, one of the things she said is, the first thing she said is, you know, who I don't like the way she called the lurkers, you know, these are the people who just like, following following you following her around, and then the crew and not so much that she, you know, doesn't mind it, but you know, there may be casting shadows or getting in the, you know, kind of getting in the way of the of the shoot. So, this is where proper screening comes in. So I get that some people might be, you might be nervous, maybe maybe it's the first time but if you screen a crew properly screened the producer properly, assess that it's going to be a professional crew, you should be able to, you know, let them in in the morning. But then kind of retreat to, in my case, I retreat to my home office, or you know, kind of wherever you're going to be, and just let the let the chute run its course, you know, you'll be in touch sort of periodically throughout the day. So to check check ins, right at different points. And this comes back to the kind of the communication strategies that have been talked about. But yeah, for the most part, you know, you can and I think that's actually a benefit, right? Like, you don't what I like about film shoots versus like, you know, Airbnb, like, you don't have to vacate your house, you know, you can remain in your you can remain in your house, which I think is is a huge benefit. So you know, people, people work from home, you can kind of work from your home office, and there can be a shoot going on downstairs, right. And like I said, before you define the spaces in your house that you allow, you don't want any shoots upstairs and you're fine. That's you can just those are off limits spaces. 44:00 It is what it is you make the rules, you set the parameters, you filter, and you connect, that's fine. facilitate what is a quote that is yours or somebody else's that you resonate with? 44:15 Ooh, a quote. Well, I don't know if this is I don't know who who attributes this, but you know, just don't, don't be afraid. Don't be afraid to take risks and make mistakes. I think that, you know, especially in real estate, you know, beginner beginners in real estate are always afraid of losing their downpayment, you know, making the wrong investment making a mistake, but I think if you can kind of change your attitude and think about we look, we all make mistakes and whenever you try something new, you're gonna make mistakes, but you know, think of it as as learning experiences. So in education, and you know, within the film shoot rental context, you know, we We've made a lot of mistakes. In I've tried, I've kind of cobbled, and that was really kind of the drivers of cobbling them all together to kind of create this course to teach other people how to get into to film three wrenches, but you just have to, you know, don't be afraid to try to try new things. And I think that, you know, film shoots are a very low risk, we didn't really talk about, you know, talked about some of the benefits, but pretty low risk way to kind of get into real estate. It's a real estate niche that doesn't require a downpayment doesn't require any underwriting you already have your you already have your asset, right. So yeah, it's a very, very low risk way to get into real estate. 45:38 Where can people find you online? I think your website is very straightforward. 45:42 Yeah. So film, shoot. rentals.com is the best place to the best place to go. I can be reached at Josh at film shoot rentals.com. And yeah, that's a that's a tough place to go. 45:56 So first of all, your course as well, what what's covered in the course? Where can people find it? I'm sure it's film so much fun to read. So, yeah, what's covered in the course of the A to Z? Any questions does come with? 46:07 Yeah, yeah. Education like that. Yeah. So, you know, launch the course. Because I kept talking to people, and people were very interested and kept asking me, you know, what kinds of questions like, Oh, how'd you get into it? Like, what about this scenario? Like, why aren't you worried about that? And so, you know, after having so many of these conversations, I decided, you know, what, like, I really learned a lot over the the years that we've been doing this, and so put together this course, that really allows people to go from, you know, not knowing anything about film shoot rentals, to very quickly getting up and running, and, you know, earning money from their homes without any typical investment that you would typically need for other traditional means of real estate. So, the course really starts with, you know, getting started. Okay, so how do I even get started in this niche? And then it gets into, you know, your listing creation? How do you create a compelling listing? How do you how do you market your location properly? What are pricing strategies that you want to employ to maximize profits for your, for your space? We talked about and spent a lot of time on communication strategies to, you know, ensure that the process runs smoothly, and that you actually finalize and booked booked issues to begin with. So turning the inquiries into confirm bookings. The course covers on shoot day, right what what to expect and what kind of strategies you want to employ for success. And then we also cover a lot of less common scenarios and how to avoid pitfalls. So you know, multi day shoots over time local regulations, what happens when things don't go, Well, you know, if you have damages, or you know, someone's or someone shows up with a crew size, that's different from what you agreed on, how do you? How do you deal with all of these, all of these situations, we also cover, like I mentioned, the interview that I included with a producer, which I think is quite helpful to understand from a producer's perspective, but I also include an interview with Amanda Hahn, who is fairly well known tax strategist and CPA. So she she wrote a great book, advanced tax strategies for the savvy real estate investor. And, you know, we spent some time in an interview where we really deep dive into the tax benefits and nuances of film shoot rentals. We also talked about, you know, you mentioned kind of the house rules and process so all of the templates scripts that I've developed to make this work over the years, I include in the in the course as well. And, yeah, depending on the depending on the plan, it also includes direct time with with me in terms of, you know, Q and A's and might even help you write your listing description, and join you depending on the plan for your first what I call an intake call, that's kind of the initial phone call after someone expresses interest in using your space. And so if someone needs a little bit more hand holding there, I'll jump on the call with them. And that first one to help to kind of close the book the shoot. 49:21 Amazing for everybody here, go check it out. Them shoe rentals.com I'll put the link in the bio of the episode and on YouTube. So please go check it out. I appreciate your time, Josh. I think I think I think we're gonna have we're gonna we're gonna put ours on and figure out how to get it going. I'm excited too because we've we've owned it for I think a year now we've still got it for a while so should be a good opportunity for everybody and still happening so we're gonna make happen. I don't 49:51 know. Yeah, I want to hear about it. 49:54 Thanks for coming on. We appreciate you coming on. If you liked this episode, go like, subscribe share with us Rent go check out his course dumpster rentals.com and we will see in the next episode stay tuned bye guys