0:00 Hey, welcome to today's episode, we have a special guest, Mr. Dale Evans. He has another podcast we're gonna talk about podcasting business. And some other stuff. I don't know we're gonna cover today, but thanks for tuning in today. Please, Ben's a special welcome to Mr. Darrell Evans. Here we go. So, Mr. Evans, where are you from? I'm not gonna call you mister. I was just saw this before. And I feel like a little kid I'm like. Yeah. All right, Darrell. So what part of the country you from? And it's also about what you do? 0:29 Yeah. I'm from Las Vegas, Daniel. Thanks for having me. Born and raised Las Vegas, Nevada. I've lived outside of Vegas for a little bit, but this is where I call home. And what we do, what I do today is I co own digital marketing agency. Let me rephrase. I own a digital marketing agency now. called Local Local Internet Marketing. And over the last 12 years, we've been helping small and mid sized companies with their customer acquisition model online, transitioning them from offline to online and helping them grow and scale. 0:59 Okay, we're gonna cover a couple things. So Las Vegas is hot. I live in the desert and it's hot out here. Like I have you seen the videos where people can eggs outside and like his nuts? 1:13 Yeah. 1:15 So I was laughing because I moved to California, Southern California two years ago, and my first summer out here, while I was pregnant, she's like, I want to McDonald's coke. And it's literally right around the corner. So, sidenote, I drove over there, and it was 116 degrees. And I was like, dying. And like by time, by time I got to the drive thru line, there was a waiting and I like to have two Cokes, because I'm gonna be right. By the time I got home, just melted and stuff. And I hit my AC and every kid died. And it was terrible. So I've ever lived in like Vegas, Vegas, but it's hot. 1:51 Yeah, it's hot, but it's dry. And this year, we've actually had a real monsoon season. So it's been a cooler summer than then many gone by. So it's not too bad. 2:01 That's good. It's good. So one thing I really want to pivot. So how long have you been an entrepreneur? Because a lot of people like, like, overnight success, and that's never happened. 2:10 Yeah, no, great question. Yeah, it's just not the way some might get lucky. But I started my first entrepreneurial venture when I was 19, when I was a sophomore in college, and but I probably would say that more formal entrepreneurial ventures really started around 2000. So that would put us at 22 years, but technically, I mean, I did run two businesses when I was in college, you would call those side hustles. A lot of people call it you know, those were not full time gigs, because I had other full time things going on. But I did cut my teeth, you know, 30 something years ago, already a couple of years ago. 2:47 I really want to hit on that. Because a lot of people like it's like, it's so like, it's a dream everybody aspires to have, but like few people make it and they fall off after years, or six months or three months. And like, what's the one thing that you can tell, again, new entrepreneurs stick around? 3:05 Focus, you know, one of the problems that I had even a couple of things, actually, if I could remember, one was believe in the thing that you're doing. And I say that a lot of times we start something because we think it's something is to make some extra money. But I think you got to believe in what you're doing and why you want to do it. And I think that's important. But then the other side of it is focus, you know, especially today, if you go back to the early 90s, when I first started my first little venture, there wasn't the internet, the internet wasn't jumping off Shopify, and ecommerce and social media and all of the being a YouTube famous star and being a tech talker. And none of that was around. So there's a lot of distractions today that I think are hurting those that are in the entrepreneurial community, myself included. There's enough different ways to make money as an entrepreneur digitally or natively offline. And I think the the one thing is focused, I've spent a lot of time trying to get my clients to stay focused, I spent a lot of time and energy myself trying to reel myself back into focus. Because entrepreneurs are big vision thinkers, and we always think we can conquer the world. And we should just try to conquer our backyard first. And then and then try to expand out a little bit. And that's the it takes discipline to stay focused. 4:22 I really want to hit on one of the things you said as far as like, it's, I think of something else you said, but it was like, I think it really helps with burnout because like if you are not if you don't have something if you don't believe in it as what you said, if you don't believe in what you do, you will burn out quick. Burnout is a real thing. Yeah, 100% 4:45 Yeah, you it's not it's not the only reason for burnout, of course, but there's all kinds of things that can lead to burnout, right, trying to do too many things at one time trying to believe that you're better at certain things and you're not not really spending in time and what I call your Superstar DNA and then finding the right team members to run alongside of you, whether that's a co founder, whether that's, you know, virtual staff or staff. But yeah, the one thing you got to be clear on when you're starting a business is the problem, your desire to solve the problem that your product or service solves passionately, right? When I started, let's just go back to starting the agency 2008 2009 2010. Everyone knows what happened in the world of finance and real estate and Wall Street, the world's in a recession. And you know, what makes me pivot from what I was doing then to do this? Well, I had a unique experience where I started digital marketing for my business at that time in 2003. So I had a six or seven year run before this, you know, when the recession really set in, and I was able to see a lot of businesses struggling and being turned down for financing and capital, which is the world that I lived in, when they had perfectly good businesses, but the industry tipped over. And they didn't know how to pivot their marketing. They were still running $5,000 a month, back of the phone book ads, they were still running five and $10,000 a month TV ads. And like, did you know about this little thing called Google? Did you know about right, and so I found it is a great opportunity not just to do the thing called digital marketing, but to help businesses grow and recover through that recycle period or that recession period, and develop skills and or strategies that they just didn't see. And they weren't ready to adapt to. And of course, now 12 years later, everybody's mostly in the game. But I'm passionate about small business and entrepreneurship. And so to see a lot of small business clients at that time that I had in my database, struggling with something I felt very passionate about solving. I felt passionate about solving it. 6:51 No, it's crazy to this day, that there's still people that don't know, like, Google's a thing. Like you can get a website, like, come on Ross. Like, it's like, get a website, get your social media channels and just hold on to those. Yeah. But it's kind of like I said, you stopped to like, you start to like, baby step people sometimes because I just saw it. Yeah. 7:13 Well, you know, there's something that I learned in college, and it was I don't remember what class it was in. But I learned about the diffusion of innovation, anyone listening to this, could Google this and see this bell curve, it's a typical economic sort of bell curve that you would see but what it was lately, it was about product innovation. And whenever something comes out, or a new product or technology comes out, you'll see a small, small percentage of the people that will be called innovators. It's a low single digit number, then the next column on the bell curve is someone they call early adopters, I think that number is around 12, or 13%. So three to four or 5% are innovators, people that are willing to jump in before the waters are even tested, then there's going to be this group called early adopters, early adopters is where I'd like to say I think I fit in most of my life. As an early adopter, there's certain things that I'll be on the rest of the curve. The next category is called the Early Majority, which is roughly a 32% a group or percentile of the population. There'll be another 32%. I think, on the late majority, now the bell curve is tipped over. And then you've got a category called laggards, people that could things have come and gone and they never knew they existed, right? And they're in that laggard category. And the fact of the matter is, we as consumers are all behaviorally on this curve at some point or another. You know, I think about my grandmother, my late grandmother, who passed away some years ago. And I remember when when the when the cable company finally decided you can no longer have analog cable, and you had to go to digital cable. And they turned off her cable, because she was like, Well, mine works fine. I don't need the new one. And they actually shut it off. Because did the analog was done. And I was like, Nanny, we have to get you the other box is not because the other one wasn't working. They just don't do that no more. So she, you know, rest or her soul. She was just but some of us. And we all understand in marketing that everyone's not ready. You know, everybody wasn't in line when the iPhone came out. Everyone doesn't care when the newest one comes out. But some of us are iPhone customers. But I never rushed to go get the earliest phone. But I'm an iPhone customer. So everyone's on this curve. And I think that's what's interesting about business and growth and marketing and just figuring out where you fit on the curve. And then where people around you fit on the curve to the point of businesses. There's lots of businesses that are still on that late majority, and even laggard to the point of your website conversation. There are some that have discounted YouTube and Google ads and all these other things. So we could go on and on about it. But that's the reality of the world we live in. 9:46 It's such a it's such a weird reality because I'm like I'm in the I'm in the digital space as well. And I'm like I produce a lot of digital content. So I'm like, everywhere, and then other people are like, I'm just gonna hide behind the camera, or hide behind something else. hide the graphic or something like you sometimes get put a face on it, and people will respect it 10:05 more. Yeah. And here's the funny thing. Look, I've got clients that are eight figure companies and they have no social profiles. They don't, they're not active on LinkedIn. So the reality is, you can still build a seven and eight figure nine figure business without social media. And let's be clear about that. So I don't buy into the hype, because I've seen enough cases of this. I remember a company that was doing about $80 million a year that we work with. And they came to us for some digital work and getting them ramped up with online lead generation. But their business model to get to 80 million had nothing to do with digital, it had to do with acquisitions, it had to do with trade shows, and all that old school traditional thing. So you can't say that 80 million is a small revenue on the old model. And they were still doing that model up until I think they hired us in 2017, or 2018. So, you know, I don't say that someone has to do something. But if there's a problem you're trying to solve, and I think the solution that we have available can be one of those solutions that I presented. I don't convince people, I just help them do the thing that they already believe they should be doing. So when they decide they should get their digital presence, more, more tight, fine tuned, when they need a better strategy for lead generation online when they need to be more present on social media. We just insert our products to help them do that. So I don't try to convince people that they have to if you don't want a website, fine. Good luck with that. But fine. 11:27 Wow, that's crazy. So you're working with large corporations that are looking to pivot into digital marketing space 11:34 small, we work small all the way up. The call I just had before you and I jumped on was a math tutoring organization. That's a one man shop. Wow, wow. Yeah. The methodology of the methodology applies. Our methodology applies to whatever size organization, obviously, the budget to scale is going to be different, right? But the methodology applies to every business on the planet. I can. I've proven it for 12 years, I first thought it was an anomaly when I started doing it myself through a couple of different businesses that I had. And now that it's digital, and now I'm 12 years later, and we've got case studies because galore. The model is about consumer behavior. It's not about technology. It's not about social media, it's not about it's about how do consumers purchase things, when they have a, they have decided to solve a problem with the product or service that you happen to sell. It's about consumer behavior. It's about owning the buyers journey, and just inserting yourself into the journey where appropriate. It's so to me, I don't you know, that's the reason why it works for the one man band, or it works for an $80 million company. 12:43 So are you doing different strategies for different markets based off of where the customers are? Because it's all you gotta go to the customers are per se. So like, if you're the math agency, you might go to YouTube, because there's a lot of people trying to learn stuff on the education side. So they might go to the YouTube side, on a preset, whereas a large corporation, they might need a combination of all these things, right? Yeah, 13:03 yeah. Yeah, it's always layered. It's always tiered. But again, the product suite that we kind of bracket things into one is about branding and visibility, brand visibility and awareness. So if you if you're online, you're going to likely need brand visibility and awareness. Now, how do we map that it does to your point, brand visibility awareness could be better for some companies on YouTube, and Facebook and Instagram, for example, it could be on Google display, or placement ads, or native advertising, those kinds of things, you know, programmatic things. But ultimately, there's a brand and awareness and visibility component, there's a lead generation and acquisition component. And then there's an optimization and scale component. And not everybody plays on all three of those tiers. But generally speaking, we're a holistic solution provider, which means we're going to try to put a light version of it for maybe that solopreneur together, or we're going to maybe go full in with but we want to make sure we were covering the all three of those components, right brand visibility, awareness, lead generation acquisition, and then optimization and scale. And all of that is what has been our sort of formula refined over the years. But that's what matters to us when we're trying to help a client get to the next level. 14:20 So have you done anything with radio and TV? 14:24 No radio and TV in days gone by I did everything else. We didn't do a ton of radio and TV. However, I have radio and TV partners, if you will, people that if if radio and TV makes sense, which I don't discount radio and TV if you're if that's the right place. You know, I'm in a conversation right now with a media partner that I say media partner, they're not partners to our company, but there will refer them to a media agency if they need TV, radio, even billboards. That being said, the we don't we stay in our lane, like so we stay in our lane, and if a client needs something outside that lane, we'll try to make an introduction Um, and we can we do that without reservation to the fact that there are other things they may need besides what we do. We just we stay in Orlando. 15:08 Gotcha. So you're doing that you're doing mostly everything else besides the big radio TV because I was laughing because we just did a, we just did radio ads for like three weeks and we didn't get any results. So it was a personal insults of mine. 15:24 Yeah. So So if we think about radio and TV, right, and, you know, for the years and years, mind you, I started in the 90s. And those were options. And I remember even running newspaper ads, right newspaper ads, classified ads, I even ran half pagers. I don't recall if I read anything in the phone book. But I definitely did magazine advertisements in the niche that I was in. And so when I started to tons of direct mail, that's how I cut my chops with copywriting was direct mail, and direct response. That was that was where I really got my thing done. But if we think about TV and radio, what do we expect from a television or radio ad, right? We expect brand awareness, visibility and impressions, we expect to get those seven to 12 to 15 touches with consumers in advance of them possibly needing what we do. Sure if there's a small fraction of people that might need it the day that they hear your message, you possibly can get a conversion, but you didn't ever call the media company or the radio company and say, what was my click through rate on the ad? You didn't say? Right? How many? You know how many conversions that I get on the website? No, no, you you bought media for impression share. So how do we duplicate that now, digitally at a fraction of the cost is what we figured out, we figured out how to duplicate TV, radio and billboards with social media, specifically Facebook, Google, Facebook, YouTube and Instagram, and it may get there at Tik Tok. And again, you know, those are the three that we play on Twitter, LinkedIn and Tik Tok, we're exploring Tik Tok. But it's we don't know if it's ready yet for this strategy. But that's what we did. We replaced TV radio Billboard, with what we do with Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube. And then of course, the media creative is slightly different than a television ad. And the goal is brand new brand impressions, awareness and engagement. That is always going to lead to higher ROI when you start the lead gen and acquisition component. So that's how we substituted it. So I'm not not a fan of TV, radio and billboard, I just didn't do it. But I know where it fits into the buyers journey. And I know where it fits into scaling a brand. 17:27 Yeah, we were we like we'll test the waters. And that was one of the things we this is tried out, see what happens, but I'm sure we got the visibility but no sales. Right, 17:37 right. Right, right. See the reason I like Facebook, Instagram to that point, reason I don't like radio and TV for this reason only, is there's no way to retarget the person who was engaged, there's no way to go back to. And you know, this is a marketer, right? What I love about Facebook, radio, Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube is based on the behavior of the viewer, based on the behavior of the audience who saw the ad clicked on the ad, watch the ad, watch the video, liked it commented or shared it or saved it or all of the other metrics of engagement, you now have a way to distinguish by behavior who was or who was not interested in that specific ad or creative, that then informs our process, right, that informs us in this, that's my knock on radio, TV. Even when I talk to our media partners, I'm like, hey, my clients want return on investment. They want leads and sales. And all you're telling me is you're gonna get us 130,000 impressions for $37, you know, CPM? And I'm like, Well, I can duplicate that with Facebook, and I can do it at five to $7. CPM, why should I recommend it? My client does this television ad. And so that's where I fight with them about it on and I'm very transparent about it, because I know the numbers. I'm not saying that television ads bad. But if my client has a limited budget, I'd much rather get them a five to $7, CPM for the same objective, then spend that much money on a in this case, it was streaming TV ads in this case. 19:09 So I have a question for you. So I'm sure you've heard of the apple privacy stuff that's happening and it's cutting out. Facebook's and monitoring, have seen some effects from that from Facebook and Instagram, as 19:26 of course if you're if you if you follow the methodology, right. So for those listening that may not be up to speed on this, about a year or so ago, Apple started blocking the tracking mechanism of the Facebook pixel. And for a lot of years, a lot of marketers a lot of companies did really well, because Facebook knew just about everything about you, even after you left their platform. And so Facebook or Apple sorry, blocked the cookies. And by the way, it's coming down the line for Google as well. Google's cookie stuff is changing, I think Turning 23. But marketers got lazy. And they were using just the Facebook pixel to do all the work. So today, so so we did see that. But here's what we decided to do, we decided, and here's what we have to understand, Daniel, if you think about it, every one of these platforms, consumers see them as social media platforms, or social networks. And I never got confused. I never got confused by what they were, what they are our advertising platforms, who gathered data. So because listen, when was the last time any of us You may or your audience paid a nickel to log into Gmail paid a nickel to log into Facebook, we've never paid to log into Instagram, we've never paid to run a Google search. We've never paid to watch a YouTube video. We've never paid to get on any of these social platforms. Why is that? Right? So 20:54 there's a whole quote that says, if the product is free, you're the product, you're the product. 20:58 Right? So for an unknowing consumer, we think of them as social media networks in my case. So back to the question, I don't want to veer off, what do we do then, if the cookies are blocked, and we can't get as rich a dataset, once the person leaves the app and goes over to your website? Well, we do things like keep them in the app, right. And Facebook has figured out how to keep people on the app and get us a better conversion, in some cases, cheaper than actually going to a conversion event on a landing page. I'm not saying landing page conversions are bad. I'm just saying that when things change, you have to change. The one thing that I remember one of the most impactful quotes that's ever affected me, and I'm reminded of it all the time is from Dr. Wayne Dyer, who's who's since passed. And it's when you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change. And so I'm always willing to change the way I look at things today, even if I looked at a different yesterday, so I never get bothered by Google algorithm updates. And then we have some issues with our SEO, I never get bothered by Facebook's algorithm changing with organic reach all those years, the minute Facebook went public, in 2013, or 2012, whatever it was, I knew the organic game was over all of this talk around tick tock and all the organic reach, get it while you can. I'm not saying don't get it while you can go get it while you can. But they will eventually start showing you ads in abundance, because they won't be able to monetize, they've got to find a way to monetize. And of course, my thinking I'm just thinking ahead is that they're going to have to get to whether the video platform is going to be comfortable with 578 10 minute videos in order to run enough ads to monetize the platform. Right. So in my mind, none of us are going to tolerate ads showing up on a 12 second viral video, no one's going to tolerate a video ads showing up inside with 30 seconds or even a one minute clip. I think they're going to be moving towards what what YouTube is. And we're all going to have to get used to that right now. Get your organic reach while you can. But it's not for you get it while you can. But at the end of the day, your job is to figure out how to advertise to your consumer and what does the platform what is the platform really trying to become and my opinion in my early research or Tik Tok is that it's becoming a bit more of a search engine like tool. And it's deciding it's helping you find more of what you're interested in, as opposed to an Instagram algorithm, right. And definitely not a Facebook algorithm because Facebook just shows you anything. But anyway, we're not going to get into all that. But as far as Apple is concerned, if your folks are listening to this and you're advertising, you've got to get better at your in app conversions. You've got to get better at your in app engagement audience building and conversion there. And it doesn't mean you shouldn't be sending them out to your website. But if you're sending them out to your website, you're gonna have some problems as it relates to Apple devices. 24:01 I really like what you said because like, I like it's I know that I know. I know a little bit about a lot of things. So I'm like all over the place with things somebody knows. But I'm actually glad you said that because I see in the Facebook Like in app campaigns and like this is weird. I'm never I'm still I'm still getting compared to you. Like I said I'm a little bit jealous for like a year or two. Oh my god I don't think that's me. But it makes sense to me now that they want to keep them on the app. So you need to use the one of the literally pages in the forms to have a mix. That was that was my jam for the whole conversation. I 24:36 know that Jim was as I didn't even say it but that was the gym. Every app wants you to keep the keep the customer on the app. The other distinction is when you change the way you look at things is remember every user every customer, potential customer prospective customer that you're trying to reach is not your customer, it's their customer. See if you think about it that way when I when I want to run Google ads with our clients and We do SEO and map optimization for local SEO, we realized that those are Google's customers, not our customers. So whenever they change the rules, we just adapt to the rules, right? If they change the game, they change the game, we tell our clients that the game changes all the time, it's my team's job to adjust to the new rules of the game, no different than a sporting event. You know, I grew up playing sports. And then I coached sports for a lot of years. And anyone who's ever watched a sporting event, their favorite team or not, whether you understand Understand sports or not, you realize that a team prepares an athlete prepares if it's MMA, or boxing, or golf or Sunday, prepare for the start of the event against whoever the competitor is going to be. And in golf, for example, it's the course it's not really though the players, it's the course they're trying to prepare for. The reality is, every great team and player regularly has to adapt to game time conditions, right, they have to adapt to what they have happening in real time. And so I guess maybe being an athlete realizing that our best plans in practice until Saturday, and the kickoff happened, and the team scored four touchdowns on us in the first quarter, all my Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Game preparation plans, they go out the window. And that happens with ad campaigns all the time. It happens with creative, it happens with messaging, it happens with landing page convert, it happens with all of it. And so if you're not up for that continuous process of improvement, testing, and measuring, right, then you just imagine if a sporting event had no score. Just imagine that you showed it right? They just didn't keep score, right. So a lot of people do in digital don't know how to keep score, and they don't know how to score the things that matter. And therefore they end up frustrated saying I didn't get any results. Like I just talked to a guy earlier before our call. And he's like, Yeah, I put some money into Facebook ads. And I just I just I just, he just said it three or four times, like I just I just didn't get anything out of it. And I'm like, What did you hope was gonna happen? And he told me what was gonna happen? And I said, Well, what ad objective Did you run? He told me what he ran on. I'm like, well, they gave you exactly what you wanted. But you wanted something different. 27:06 So versions? 27:10 Yeah, whatever you write, he ran a whatever campaign, a brand awareness campaign and he wanted conversions. I'm like, What? No, you spent $200 on brand awareness, they gave you what you wanted. The problem is you tried to go the cheap route to get something more expensive. Right? Yes, like diamond rings versus cubics or Kona, they don't cost the same, right? If you want to diamond get to Diamond, it's gonna cost you a bit more right. If you want to conversion, you got to pay for a conversion. You can't right so I use a lot of analogies to be funny because sometimes you got to shake people up out of their own thinking. Yeah, like get real. Like for real. You went to you went to doggone a Mexican restaurant, and you're mad because they don't got burgers. What? Come on man. 27:52 That's a that's, it's such it's such a such a like, like, like Frost's like a&b thinking, and I'm like, Whoa, that's crazy. 28:02 Yeah, we tried to simplify it, though. This is you and I talking a little bit geeky about this stuff. But we try to simplify it for customers. So they just, they get it. They understand brand awareness. They understand lead generation, and they understand, you know, growth and scale to a certain degree. So we just try to bracket the conversation around what are we trying to do? What's the outcome? Well, I need to get brand awareness. But I also need lead generation cool. But let's be clear about what this ad was designed to do. And then what this one was designed to do, or what this piece of content was designed to do versus this one, and what this platform is for versus this one, you don't go on Facebook, looking for people who have an emergency service. That's the wrong place. I can't tell you how many people like plumbers or roofing companies or other emergency service scenarios, and you're trying to run Facebook ads. And I'm like, you can play the brand awareness game there in case they have an emergency. But I can assure you unequivocally, that your job is to be on Google ads and be present there because I have one of those weird plumbing emergencies where my water heater broke a long time ago. And I came home and water is gushing out of my, my garage. And I'm like, I have no clue what the heck I'm supposed to do. Like I don't even know how to stop the water. That's like problem number one. So at that point, you know, I'm at Google. I'm not on Facebook saying hey, I ain't got time to figure out hey, Anybody got a referral for a plumber? No, no, I need a prepolymer now, give me us give me give me 10 digits. So I can call them like I need Hale. So one 29:27 thing I really want to ask him I'm really curious what your question is going to be but as you know what threes in its infancy, and it's coming out? And one of the things I like about what three is that everybody's going back to their own their own audience to buy things. What's your opinion on that? Because I kind of like me as me as a marketer. I'm always trying to convert leads to come to my audience because I want them to come come to me whenever they need certain things in my niche. So it's more like I'm really trying to convert and build that credit. Build with a customer where they they see me and come to me whenever they need. 30:04 Yeah, I think you're, you know, web three is too early for a lot of people listening this right now it's it's it's even too early to project because as with anything we're really at the early adoption. Sorry, we're at the innovators stage, we're not even close to the early adoption stage. And, and so my theory about all of this is as we continue to mature these technologies, these experiences these products, the thing that always matters to me is, and this is going to sound maybe, to some, I'd like having a social media following I think it's okay. But I think the number one asset you can own as all of this transition is your email list, right? Your job as a marketer, your job as a business, I can't tell you how many big brands that I talked to bigger brands, smaller brands, who discount having an email address, and I think all of it spins wherever we go, whatever we do going forward, the focus has to be on first party data, which translates by the way, that piggies back to your earlier question about the Apple privacy issues is you have to own the data yourself. Stop relying on these platforms to own your dataset. How do you introduce a web three technology? How do you introduce building a community? And right now I think community is a you know, community is an under discussed topic in the world of marketing. But you can't build community on Facebook anymore. Oh, geez. How does that happen? Yeah, I answered the phone. Come on, man. Now. That's interesting. I put it on airplane mode. But Bluetooth was still connected that makes because it's tied to my apologies. 31:45 There. Oh, come on. Oh, yeah. Sorry about that. 31:50 No, I had it on airplane. But I forgot my our phone is tied to the Bluetooth. Sorry. So back to what I was saying. I apologize. That's terrible. The President was calling. The you got to own your you got to own your data. Right. So I think if anything, getting ahead of what what, what will be web three? And what possibilities we can use? It's about what do we what kind of dataset do we have? Right? Are we keeping I remember, a client of ours had 55,000 customers 55,000. And I think of the 55,000. And they had a call center, they were still doing the call center thing. And they didn't have maybe 10,000 emails, maybe. And they've been around 30 something years. And I'm like, here's what you need to do. This has nothing to do with digital marketing is this hat you must, as your as your call center calls back. They're your donors. They were a nonprofit, as you call back your donors for the next round of asks, collect, you should ask that ask them if you can get their email address, because and it's not so you can bombard them with donor requests, although they probably would rather respond to a donor request via email and then take your call. But from a data set, how do you find more donors in the world of digital if you don't have the data? Right? So those are the things that I think about Daniel is how much first party data do you have, which is first name, last name, email, phone number, there's obviously more you can go into, but how much of that do you own? Whether they've transacted business or not? And do you have a rapport with those people? Are you building some sort of community, whatever that means to you? So that you have their ear and trust, as you mentioned earlier, right? Be the brand, build trust, establish rapport with these people become a resource. I've been saying this for 21 years, I think in a row. As a business. My job is to be a resource to the people who look to us for answers whether they hire us or not. And that's an abundant thinking mentality. Not I gotta close a sales mentality. Yeah. Yeah, it's 33:49 a it's a pays off in the long run. Whenever you're like, even you on the podcast, you're finding all this value pays off in the long run over time and distance in the long run. Yeah, I like I like that. You're like, I like doing these because I like learning from people like you. So stuff, I don't know. I say I don't know everything. But whenever I'm talking to somebody else, I know a lot. 34:14 Yeah, yeah, definitely. Listen, this is all no one has all the answers to this stuff. I'm learning something every day. The name of my parent company is called Kanye 365. And that stands for constant and never ending improvement. 365 days a year. That's how I think that's how I'm wired. I don't sleep. And I don't pretend to know everything. And I don't ever pretend that I'm going to know everything. I just pretend that I'll figure it out. I'll get the resources. I'll get around the right people. I'll get the right coaching. I'll get the right support. And that's what my that's what my company stands for. So, in digital, if we didn't have that attitude, we would be done. Right because it changes all the time. People count on us. usual kind of, 34:54 here's your kind of call to action opportunity. 34:56 Okay, Daniel, Daniel set up a call to action. So up This is the obligatory call to action. Because if you're watching this on YouTube or anywhere else visually, you will see right beneath me that Daniel has cued up my website. Therefore, I will invite you, if you're interested in connecting with me to go deeper in business growth strategy or coaching, head over to Darryl evans.net. Or you can find me anywhere on Instagram, or any social network at Mr. Darryl Evans. There you go, Daniel, we have done it. We've paid the bills. 35:28 In conversation, I thought it was I'll be good for me to actually like, Hey, this is your call to action on here. 35:35 I appreciate it. That's so fun. Man. I love you, man. That's a good one. That's the first time that's happened where someone just popped it up and told me to do a call to action in the middle of the episode. 35:43 Or lean right into it. And I'm like, That's awesome. But in like February, listen to this. This is really a marketing call. So I hope you're catching on the cues, because there's a lot of there's a lot of open queues here. 35:57 Yep, yep. Yeah. 35:59 So let's talk about podcasting. Because I love this conversation. If you listen to this year, listen to this in the podcast, because I like podcasting. So tell us about your podcast, and how many episodes you're at home. You've been doing it all that good stuff, and what your what your podcast is about? 36:13 Yeah, thank you for that. The podcast is called the mind shift podcast with Darrell Evans. And you can find it wherever you're listening to Daniel show right now. We are we started about three years ago. And the intent of the show was to really sit down and have conversations with entrepreneurs about their growth journey. I call it the journey from inspiration to realization. And then when life knocks us down, from break down to break through. To me, that's the circle of life for us is either entrepreneurs or parents or just in life in general. We all start with this vision or goal for what we want to do. And we set our plans out we get very excited. And of course, as we use the sports analogy earlier, we have to make gametime adjustments. And life can knock us down in certain ways. Sometimes it's our fault. Sometimes it's economies, sometimes it's the wind blowing. Sometimes it's the sun didn't come up with the rain clouds came in whatever it is, we have to adjust. And I think success is about committing to that journey. And the ups and the downs. I think Tim Ferriss, I think about a blog post, I saw that Tim Ferriss wrote 2220 2009 2010, something like that. And he called it the entrepreneurship roller coaster. And it's so true, I've already believed in it. But when I saw that it was pretty interesting. And so that's what we do on the show I we started as an interview show, I think we're around Episode 150 5253, something like that right now. This year, my team encouraged me to add another segment to the show. So we do a show on Monday, which is just me teaching, marketing strategy, business strategy, growth, mindset, things like that. And then we have a third segment of the show coming out in 2023, call the strategy call segment where I'm going to be kind of on the hot seat to help a business owner solve a problem in under 15 minutes. And so it'll be a nice short, quick, they get to pick my brain because I can't take pick my brain calls on the phone the way is that as many as I get. So I want to build a community where entrepreneurs can come in and get some help and resources and we can, whether they're ready to buy services or hire for coaching or any of that it doesn't matter to me, I just don't want entrepreneurs out here struggling and believing things that don't work or struggling longer than they need to. So I just wanted to provide a resource so we're going to be dropping that series in 2023. I really I 38:27 really liked that. That sounds like a really cool thing because like even being like, like one of the like, if you're everybody's anybody has been around for a little bit last year and a half that you've heard of clubhouse and like the problem I haven't clubhouse is like, yeah, I can speak for an hour. But the problem is I can't reuse this content. That's the biggest problem I have with clubhouse. 38:43 Yeah, so my thing is, I, I'm with you on that. And I know some people were hacking their way through that. And it just, it was too complicated for me to do. And I was just like, so that's why I went back to the comment on community. And I wish I would have started the militia podcast when I said I was gonna do it. This is again, things that have to do with focus, I said I was going to do it in 2016 I didn't start it till 2019 until actually one of my mentors called me out on it and said, stop talking about it when you're going to do it and that sometimes you gotta have someone in your face about stuff like that. So we did finally start it and then I wish I would have done this. But again, everything happens for a reason and everything is for its right time. I'm seeing enough now where building a community where we can gather every month in a low friction environment and really helps support one another. And again, a lot of people want to get on my calendar and I just can't do it. I get the free advice thing Yes, I'll happen I'm happy to do mentorship and things like that, but I just got to do it in a leverage fashion so so we're gonna be doing some things inside the mind shift community to to address that and, and be true to what I said which is being a resource to entrepreneurs everywhere. 39:51 One thing I really liked that you're I love I love that little networking segment. So so so cool, how podcasts evolves and stuff you want to do involves Cisco Is it like, hey, this vehicle segment and you and your team are seeing that, that credibility? And their ability to you can do that provide? Because I love the thing I love. I love the idea of such a cool idea. What is I'm asking a community question because I think a lot of people that want to make an impact need to build a community. So what's your, what's your like two cents on community? Now that we're talking about, because I'm big on community as well, we have a big community. And I like I like the community aspect of it. 40:29 Yeah, it's new for me. So I'll just share with you what I'm thinking about because this is it's not done yet. It's not even the community isn't open, or should I say this particular new segment is not open. But the way I think about it is a, I want a private community where people don't feel like they have to be distracted by 1000 things. So we will not be doing it on the traditional Facebook group, we're going to be doing it in a private community app. And I want to be able to gather and host classes that are for learning and education purposes. The goal is obviously you got to start with building an email list, right? Because no one's going to just come and join your community. I don't think unless you're a brand name that already has credibility, I assume I have none. So I'm going to invite people through the pain points that we will look to hopefully solve, put them on my email list. And if and when they're ready, we'll invite them to join the community, we'll obviously invite them on a continuous basis, because we'll be doing live q&a s and then we'll be doing and if you want to participate either as someone listening to the q&a, or if you just want to be in the community to go through our monthly masterclass. So we're going to do a monthly masterclass on a topic of something that's working right now. And then also doing the Q and A's and those Q and A's will be the ones that will be recorded and linked out to the podcast. 41:46 So you're making the community to produce the content for the podcast? I was. 41:52 I mean, it's bigger than that. But yeah, in a way, I mean, the community. Yeah, the community is going to lead to our live events and our coaching on that side of the mind shift companies. I also have toyed with the idea of partnering up with other podcasts to just build more of a media network because I don't talk about all things in my world. And so what I have found is a lot of entrepreneurs, as we said earlier, get distracted, and they need this. And so they go there, and then they need that. So they go there, and then they get that. So they and I've the best benefit of me in the last three years, podcasting is the network of great entrepreneurs that I am around now that have skill sets and talents and services that I know every entrepreneur is going to need that I don't deliver. And so we're looking at community from a holistic standpoint, not just Darrell as the brand or mind shift is the brand is like no, we know they're gonna need ops, they're gonna adopt support, they're gonna need system support, they're gonna need right branding and creative support. And so for those that want to make sure that they're sort of surrounded by a group of people that can help support that dialog, then that's kind of what the bigger vision is, I don't, I always say this. We're gonna hold a live event for four days, three and a half days. And I will not hold the stage for three and a half days. I know some gurus do that. I'm okay, if I'm not on the stage the whole time. I don't want to be on the stage the whole time, because I want to just surround myself with other great entrepreneurs who have things to contribute to our community. And that's the platform that I want to build. 43:27 So, sidenote, we're actually doing an event this next week, this week, Thursday, we're doing an event in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. Okay, I think I set up 30 minutes speaking time for myself. I mean, my pardon? 43:39 Yeah. Yeah. Same concept, right. Same concept. So 43:43 I think we're aligned in that in that attitude. I think one thing that's really cool about business is that there's a lot of when you when you start a business, you think you're all alone, but there's a whole community out there. And there's communities out there that are willing to help you and teach you and help you to the struggle because it's a it's a it's a lonely world by yourself and entrepreneurship. And when I first started my brush, my first business, I had like one guy that I was talking about business and that was it. But when I entered my as a pivoting and niching down into another niche, I saw how big actually entrepreneurship community really is. And I'm like, Okay, this is I was alone for two years. And like I couldn't I mean, males out there, 44:25 you'll burn out, you'll burn out if you stay alone as an entrepreneur and listen to it. I didn't get here. I'm coached and mentored and advised, weekly and monthly, even at the level of 30. I just don't believe I'm that smart. I mean, Unbeliev I'm smart enough to go to the right places to figure things out. But it is you it's just a hard journey if you're just going by yourself. And I said this just in a post, I think on my Facebook page, and I believe this wholeheartedly. I've been very fortunate, especially in the last 1520 years. Nobody tells me that I can't do anything but I hear so many people get talked to Some people say to them, Well, I think that's a dumb idea. You're never going to succeed at that. Like, I'm really fortunate, like I just, and I thought, why is it that nobody says anything about like my crazy ideas sometimes. And this is what I said, If anyone tells you that you can't do something, they should only get a chance to tell you once. And that was the post. And it went, not viral. But whatever, it got a lot of engagement compared to my normal posts. And my point to that is, don't stick around with peep, don't hang out with people that are trying to poopoo your dreams, the short side is they may not even understand what you're talking about. So don't tell everybody what you're trying to work on. Then you just ended if they are negative, get away from them. Love them from a distance, right? Because sometimes the negative people are close close to you love them from a distance and closest people to you. Sometimes, right? And then the other thing is just tell them less. Just tell them less. Hey, how's your business going? Cool. Leave it at that. Stop trying to brag it's not you know, don't try to pull them into your dream because they got their own damn dreams, right? So, you know, if someone ever says you can't do something, they should only tell you once and I think that's why I don't have anybody around me that tells me anything negative because if they did tell me they only told me once and I forgot about it because I don't hang out with them no more. 46:19 So this lead lives my next question was you kind of answered but what is it quote that is yours or somebody else's that you resonate with? 46:26 Oh, geez, so many. Like I said, change the way you look at things things you look at change Dr. Wayne Dyer. I, my podcast, the core message of our podcast and what mind shift does is shift your mind and you'll shift your results. I've been through a lot of crazy stuff. When you're an entrepreneur, you fail a lot, you you're you're ridiculed a lot you take a ton of risk. And I think the the thing that I've learned that has helped me navigate all of it. And again, it's not pretty, it's not pretty, it's pretty honest on the outside, and most people would realize on the inside. So for me the quote, you know, shift your mind. And you'll shift your results is very much the same as Wayne Dyer's but I looked at it from my own life. And you know, if I had to pick one other one from somebody that I think probably when I heard it, it probably meant that much to me back then. And it stuck with me was something Tony Robbins said, in my again, I was in my early 20s. And he said, it's at the moment of your decision that your destiny is shaped. It's at the moment of your decisions that your destiny is shaped. And again, I've got that one was pivotal for me, because I was in my early 20s, I was making some reckless decisions. And you know, you think about, okay, at the point of decision is when I technically have shaped my destiny, let's just do what early 20 year old dudes, do, they go out to parties, and they drink, right? Some of them, some of them, right. So if you think about it is that the moment of the decision to take the drink that the destination has shaped? Now it doesn't mean always right. But that was impactful for me to start making better decisions about what I really wanted in life. And if I really wanted that, and I couldn't do that, right? If I really want this, then I can't go to the party if I really want this. And I can't go to the club if I really want this. And so you got to get clear on that. And if I may share one more. And this was this is one for anyone who's going through a challenge, because this was one that you know, unfortunately, I had a business bankruptcy, personal bankruptcy back in oh eight. And it knocked me for a loop because I thought I did everything right. And on the other side of it, you could look back and say things I could have done differently. But in the moment, I thought it was going to take me out. And it was this quote from Jim Rohn. That kind of helped me turn it all around, I was kind of on the tail end of getting myself back out of the pit. But it was this quote, and it was it's not the blowing of the wind that determines your destination. It's the set of the sail. And here's the key part, the same wind blows on us all. The wind of economic change the wind of All right, so it was like, it's not the blowing of the wind that determines the destination. It's the set of the sail. It was the last piece that got me the same wind blows on us all. So in that moment, while I'm going through personal business, bankruptcy and other things in my funnel in my personal life, I'm like, Yeah, I'm not the only one who went through this because I was sitting like I was the only I was the biggest failure on the planet in my mind. Right? How do I lead a company that was successful career that was successful get here? How did that happen? Like how did I get here? And I could I couldn't wrestle with the dialogue. And it was the same wind blows on us all was the piece that I think made me step back and realize while everybody didn't land where you are, you're not the only one who landed here and I just was able to take a little bit of pressure off myself that I had screwed it all up. Right And so that was a really important quote, I've I've referenced that many, many times. I know that was three or four instead of one. But hopefully those are helpful to those listening. 50:08 Know, it's very, very helpful. I think, I think a lot of people, a lot of entrepreneurs struggle that they they beat themselves up more than they should, but they've gone further than anybody else has. 50:19 That's powerful. That's, that's powerful in their 50:22 own way. And it's just like, their, their their own, like their own enemy. In some cases where they they beat themselves down so much like, I'm a failure, I'm a failure, I'm a failure. I'm like, No, you made it farther than anybody else had never tried. So you gotta you gotta give yourself grace, because you stepped out and you did something that other people would never do. 50:42 That I was well said. Yeah, that's so true. 50:45 So great to be listening, and hopefully, hopefully got value from that. But last question, it looks like you're a reader. I'm not a reader. So can you recommend three books for people that aren't readers to read? 50:57 Or the entrepreneurs? Or what is the mindset books? What? Which which genre? 51:02 Your three most influential books, whether it's whether it's mindset book or entrepreneur book? 51:08 Yeah. So it's hard to really narrow it, narrow it to three, because I do get in and out of books. But if I picked three, good lord, 51:17 that's the hard part. 51:18 It is it is. So from an entrepreneurial perspective, I think probably one of the books that I get is just has to be read as Cashflow Quadrant from Robert Kiyosaki. And what I think about that is there's a distinction between become going from employee to entrepreneur, and we think we've made it but there's an as he describes, in the Cashflow Quadrant is there's another two quadrants that we should be aspiring to get to. And so I won't go into the detail there. But I think that book is for an entrepreneur. I think it's a it's a it's a must read. She's power of the subconscious mind, Joseph Campbell. There's lots of books out today on on, we do more damage to ourselves in the dialogue that we have, in our mind, between our own two ears than anyone on the outside could ever do. And I want to say, I think it's an African proverb, I think I first heard it from Les Brown. And it says, jeez, can I put it together really quick? Gosh, it I can't remember exactly. But it's like, if you can take care of your inner self, no one on the outside could ever hurt you. Right. And so the power of the subconscious mind, I think, Joseph Campbell, that book is is probably one that I'd put up there. Geez, third one, so many good books, let me take a look. 53:01 They got a cheat, he's cheating. He's cheating. Now. 53:04 There's so many, there's so many. I mean, I think seven habits of highly effective people as a given 53:15 those seven habits have governed quite a bit of my journey, because I read it in my in the 90s. And these are not some of the books that are probably most talked about today, especially the the latter two. And it's not to discount some of the newer ones. But I got my start at a time when, you know, if I threw in Awaken the Giant Within Tony Robbins was another critical book for me. Back in the day, I remember there was one thing about the book, there was a visual imagery piece of a section of that book that really talked about how to overcome some of the stories we tell ourselves, but and he used an analogy of a table. And a table can't stand if it doesn't have four legs. And so the table represented a belief system or a belief framework that was sabotaging our life. But at the same time, it could support our life if we just changed the legs. So the analogy was, Can you pull the legs out of that belief, because the belief has to have supporting reasons. And it was just that was another thing. I mean, so there's so many we I just don't want to take up too much time here, but for different reasons in different stages. Those are a few of the books that I think are going to help some of the listening audience. 54:27 Well, I appreciate that. A lot of those links that I'm not I'm not a reader, but I need to do better at it. So 54:34 for myself. The other thing is I became an audible person. So I consume books. I often I wasn't sure if audible listening to books on audible was the same as reading and I did it anyway. And then I just I did hear some psychology reports or some studies that listening is as effective as actually sitting down to read them. And so for me, I travel a bit and move around a bit and so I I go to the gym and I can kill some time, or do that at the same time. So whatever everyone's pleasure is, but I think we always want to be learning. And you know, Google University is not always right. 55:14 So there we go. We're gonna end it right here. This is such an amazing episode. I went longer than I should have said I was going to, but it was such a good conversation. And it's fine. It happens. Thank you, man. It happens. But Darryl evans.net Check it out. If you're interested in marketing services, and definitely the host of the mind shift podcast that it's right there. Check it out. I appreciate your time here. Oh, this is such a been it's really been a great conversation. I learned some stuff. Hopefully it's gonna take some takeaways. stuff as well. 55:45 Absolutely. My pleasure. Just want to thank you for being such a gracious host. I'm always appreciative of anyone who wants to open up their platform for dialogue. I know what it takes to podcast. I know what it takes to align guests. I know what it takes to produce this work. And so I appreciate you doing the work and then setting up a stage and a space for us to have a rich conversation today. So it's been fun for me. 56:05 You go on with that wonder if you liked the show, please check it out in all channels. We appreciate you listening to this episode. Check us out. Next up so thank you. Have a good day, guys. Bye