It's important to establish a mutually beneficial relationship between hard money lenders and developers in order to ensure the success of a real estate project. By finding ways to create win-win terms and bridging the gap between these two parties, you can increase the chances of a successful deal.
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0:02 Hey, welcome to today's episode of the high with this podcast. I'm your host, Mr. Daniel Martinez. We have a special guest, Mr. Brian Grimes. Where are you? Are we out of the country? 0:13 I'm out of New York. I'm out of the New York area. Yeah. 0:16 New York. I've been up there, twice a bit over twice. And I drove a semi truck through New York Holika. I was going to a lot. And I took a detour through New York. And when I'm there, I haven't been in here since I was like, 17. So let's say it was like $100 Total had Instant Regret. Yeah, 0:37 exactly. Exactly. They get you come in and go into New York. They're gonna pull the money out of you. 0:44 I'm like, This is crazy. Oh, and then I have another. This is not real estate related for everybody listen to the show. But this is this is my New York experience. So I was when I hit New York, I was going north. And I hit some roadway where it was all cars. And I've never seen that in my like driving career. Never. I've never seen that before. So I'm like, I'm just following the GPS. And like, all the cars are honking at me. Give me the finger yelling at me. And I'm just like, I'm just trying to get to the freeway route. I know I made a wrong turn. This isn't there wasn't even a shoulder to pull over to what are those? 1:17 Yeah. Yeah, I have no just normal New York City driving man. It's, it's, it's a zoo. And they gave you the warm welcome of the horn honking. I mean, there's some areas like when I go into, I'm from Philly. So when I go back to Pennsylvania, it's like you're a little lighter on the horn. But in New York, it's just like a third muscle. It's just, you just go right for it. If they don't take off when the light turns green, you just squeezed the horn, it just comes right out of you. But you have to turn that off when you get into other areas where it's not, you know, customary. 1:52 So maybe maybe we'll start with this too. But like, how is it dealing with like New York like tenants, New York owners, like, like when you talk about like I most of my deals are in Texas, it's like a different type of like, Southern drawl. And people are mostly kind in most ways, new people probably like violent. 2:11 New York is New York's a tough area, just because of the landlord tenant laws, there's just not friendly towards the landlords. So, you know, people can really squat in those houses. And, you know, it could take you six to eight months to do an eviction if that. So it's a really tough place to be in landlord, it's kind of like California is it's just like, I wouldn't be a landlord there if you paid me. And New York is another place where it's just difficult. So most of my properties are in Philly, South Jersey, Delaware, Baltimore, and, you know, parts of Texas like Arlington, so places where it's a little bit more, you know, landlord friendly. 2:50 That's crazy. So most stuff you're doing in New York like flips. Tell us a little about yourself. Like how'd you get in real estate? Holly been in real estate? 2:57 Yeah, like that? No, definitely. So I started off in real estate a little over a decade ago. And I, you know, I just came out of the nine to five, I was a nine to five warrior. I started off working 100% commission as a financial planner. So I'm ripping and running through the streets, selling people insurance, annuities, investment planning. And as I'm driving around, I'm seeing all these properties. And I knew a little bit about real estate, I had a buddy who was doing like buying whole section eight investing. So I was saving all of my Commission checks and working towards putting that into real estate. And I remember hitting one big sale, I was battling I was with a buddy of mine who also got in real estate. And we're about to walk out the door of this like annuity sale. And the person's got, like, not a ton of money from what we think. And we get up we're like, all right, it was fine, fine, Miss Jones, you know, we'll see you for the next annual review. And she goes, Oh, by the way, I got a quarter million dollars in this Thrift Savings Plan. Can you guys do something with that. So we're like, of course, we put it in an annuity. And we get a nice commission check. And I bought my first house with that. So I got an FHA house hack on a duplex within a knockin unit in the basement illegal unit in the basement that the owner was living in. And I was just going to live in the basement unit and rent out the top two and live for free. So that was kind of like my first deal. That's, that's pretty 4:25 interesting. From the financial financial side, there's a lot of hustle when you come from the sales side that like that really like transfers over 4:37 Yeah, yeah, sales is everything like the guys that I was working with. And under at the time, they told me like, this sales stuff is gonna make you a monster for the rest of your life. No matter what you do. The skills will transfer and I mean, it couldn't have been more right. It makes you 100% Fearless, especially when you're working 100% Commission right out of college, when everybody else is you know, I went to Columbia you versity so everybody else is knocking down serious money. We got people in investment banking, knocking down a buck 80. They're working 20 hour days, but they're making good money. And, you know, I'm just trying to scrape pennies together to get some gas in the car. So I can go and try to run some more sales. But it definitely gives you what we call like Rhino skin, your skin gets 10 inches thick. You can handle adversity, and it carries through to everything, even to this day, everything I do. 5:28 Yeah. It's like, the athletes and the salespeople they do really, really well and entrepreneurship man, like, yeah, like, it's a bit. It's amazing to watch him work because it's just like the blood sweat and tears and pain is always there. 5:42 Yeah, and I'm lucky to have them both, you know, my first, I was nationally ranked in high school in basketball, I grew to be about six, five, at the age of 14, my first high school game, they flew us out to play some guy in Akron, Ohio named LeBron James, who we didn't know much about at the time, but you know, absolutely insane experience sold out crowd at Akron University. And LeBron was a stud at, you know, 1718 just an absolute monster. So definitely having that that sports background playing through college. It carried over as well. It gave me that, that work ethic, that delayed gratification type of attitude to put in the work and just keep failing forward if you have to. 6:29 Yeah, it's, it's a necessity and entrepreneurship. So it's like, people that don't do that or have don't have the background like they fail once. Oh, no. 6:39 Yeah. You figure it out. Yeah. It's where you figure it out. You keep going. You keep going. You get hurt you rehab. You go in the gym, you get an ice bath, you figure it out, and you come back the next day you fight again. 6:52 It takes take your time. I'll come back. I'll see you tomorrow. 6:55 Yeah, exactly. 6:58 That's funny, man. That's so cool, man. So are you gonna do a lot of flips? You know, a lot of rentals. What's that look like right now? Like, what was what was your portfolio like? And what's your like your, like your day to day in the real estate space right now? 7:11 Yeah, so my focus when I when I started to get good at real estate, like I started off just by saving money and buying houses parking capital, in deals like we most all of us do. And then you run into that brick wall where you're like, Well, how much money can I keep saving to buy houses like I'm just gonna keep going broke, and I'm not, you know, I'm not getting anywhere any faster. So I started to learn full gut renovation, I actually became obsessed with it. I found this guy on YouTube. He might have had like, 500 views on his video at this time. But he's like walking in houses. And these are properties. He bought off the sheriff sale. So he just opens the door for the first time. He's got his camera man. And he opens the door, the ceilings caved in. And he was just fearless. He's like, Yeah, we'll forget, renovate this and eight to 12 weeks. And I'm like, what I want that confidence. Like this guy, this guy has something that can make me a millionaire, if I can get my hands on that confidence. So I started to obsess over this. And before I knew it, within a year, I was doing three full gut jobs on a burnout, a tear down and a shell, all on one block in a C class neighborhood. And I just fell in love with it. So fast forward, you know, I've done over 300 Full gut renovations bursts strategy on buy and hold deals. Over the last five to seven years really most of that I had years where I've done over 100 You know, burst strategy deals. And that's kind of my thing is buying and hold and building cash flow for the future. Because we want to get paid over and over again for what we did not for what we're doing, you know, today. 8:42 That is crazy. Eight to 12 weeks. That's yeah, 8:47 yeah, it's a the eight weeks might have been salesy on his end, but 12 weeks is doable. When you get your systems together, you get your people together and you have good transitions. So it takes it's something you have to scale into with the right systems, but it's 100% possible, especially if you're buying properties that are already in show condition. Just get them down through the four walls and going through the progressions 9:11 so you got the you got the capsule left as our cap. 9:14 Yeah, it keeps you uh, people asked me they're like, Why do you have that hard hat is because that's that's what got me there. You know that blue collar energy. That's what got me there. And I I always stay tapped into this even though you know, now I'm kind of more on the operations end of it and air traffic control and leveraging the tech boots on the ground. Putting your people in place and standing in those shells is what gets you to where you want to be. So I never forget about it. Yeah, 9:43 the team, the team in place to have the competence in your team and to like, push them to complete the job. So like, eight weeks. I just sounds like something a lot of work. 9:57 Yeah. Well, I consider like riding a bike, like your first full gut renovation is going to take you six to eight months. I don't care who you are, because it takes some feeling out and you have to learn the ropes a bit hope you don't get burned by a contractor like I did, I had a guy run off with 40 grand on my first deal. So hopefully that doesn't happen to you. But as you progress, it becomes like riding a bike. I mean, the first 100 deals, there are definitely a lot of crazy things that get thrown at you. But after that first 100, everything's just a replay. So you get better and better. And before you know it, you could kind of just feel your way through a deal and build a deal remotely out of the out of town. Some people are building houses with my systems from out of the country. So you know, you can really leverage this stuff to make it more passive than you could imagine with the technology from today. 10:50 Yeah, I was just like technology from today really is like it's made becoming an entrepreneur and like managing your business as a whole a whole lot easier. Way easier. 2030 years ago, like we have a definitely have a hack. 11:05 Yeah, we have, we have an unbelievable hack. And I think like a developer from the 80s would look at us and just be like, Are you guys crazy? Are you extremely lazy? Like what is wrong with you people? Because if they, yeah, a little bit of both, because, you know, they didn't have a smartphone, I could send anybody in with an iPhone to go and spec properties report back to me, I can put smartphones in my contractors hands and use applications where I can get updates and inspection reports and all different types of things that didn't even exist. So we have a unique opportunity today. And there's a gap, you know, because the robotics industry, it is coming to shake up real estate. So there's a gap here where you can get in and grab hundreds of properties before like the next wave of innovation takes over. And there's, you know, another hurdle and and barrier to entry. 11:56 Yeah, it's definitely a definitely adapting to the future. Because if you don't adapt any left behind, and I'm sure Yeah, across investors that are stuck in the weeds still. And you're like, 12:07 ya know, I've had people that I've leapfrog like people who've gotten in real estate before me, they had you know, 1015 properties. And then you know, two years go by, they're like, Hey, how many you got, I'm just crossing over 100. And they're at 20. You know, but it's because of the systems, it's because of how I play the game, I really play the game with team building and systems building. Whereas there are a lot of do it yourselfers who watch HGTV, and they want to stand in the house and pick up the hammer and really try to do everything themselves. What they don't show you on HGTV is, you know, those people are only getting a couple of deals done a year doing it themselves, you really need leverage and big teams in order to scale. So I always focused on the scale of the operation versus you know, figuring out how to just do everything myself. So, you know, that's how I definitely excelled past people. 12:57 That I think it's a it's like a mindset, like hurdle that most people can't even overcome, but like, I'm the best tailor out there. And I just want to do it all myself, and it's gonna look perfect, pristine, and like only one detail. 13:12 I don't want to do tile, only thing I want to lift is this, that's the only thing I want to lift all day is, is this thing and and this will make you more money than, than these and then a hammer, you know, it really will. If you know how to leverage that technology, it will make you more money than anything. And your contractors, they need you to leverage the tech, because that's what they're not good at. They're better than you no matter how good you can train and get yourself they're always going to be better than you why because their uncle taught them how to build houses when they were four years old. You know, they've been doing this since they could walk. So you're never going to get to that level. But on the technology side, you can assist them and fill the gaps that they have at such a high level that as a team, you just combined to form the superpower that can produce massive profits. So you're more valuable to each other by staying in your proper roles. 14:01 So I have a couple questions. We'll start off with tools and resources to kind of keep your team together and everyone on the same page. Because that's its own thing right there. 14:12 Yeah, I'll tell you the best resource, the best resource I came across in this this resource 10x my production, like it sped up my business so fast, and reduced my involvement in the communication process that it was just insane. It made it like feel passive. And that's the Marco Polo app. So at the time, the Marco Polo app was a free app. So so I put it in the business. And my brother my brother's like he's an engineer mine, I'm a finding his mind. So he he does commercial granite all across the country, brilliant guy. And we always get together we're talking systems like I talk to my brother three, four times a day. And 50% of the time it's about real estate because we're doing deals all over the place and and doing things and he's like, You need to get a virtual walkie talkie for these guys. I feed them the Marco Polo app. So I'm like, alright, I'll do it. And I start building out channels and team systems and interlinking, the communications and showing them boots on the ground, Hey, you don't have to get out of get in your car and drive over there, to see anything, just tell the guy to tap into the Marco Polo, and make him report to you two times a day. So I'm starting to build up these different communication checkpoints. And before I know it, these guys are communicating and getting stuff done faster than they ever have, because they've never used this technology. So it took away, it would be the equivalent of taking away your morning commute. Like if I if I take away your commute, your morning and evening commute, you have an extra three hours of production in your day for like the average person. So it was the equivalent of that for your entire business for 100 contractors. So the speed was like insane, or a guy's at Home Depot. He's about to buy the wrong material. But then he gets hit on on the app. Oh, is this it? No, no, it's this and they're like, oh, but that saved us five hours, the hour, he was gonna get it the hour, he was going to stand in line to buy it the hour, he's going to drive to drop it, get smacked over the head, take it back stand in line for another hour, you know, it starts to create this massive efficiency. So that's, that's the biggest tool that I still use to this day. And if only if you only do that in your real estate operation, not only will your 10 extra speed, but you'll keep yourself from getting burned by contractors, because you'll see a lot more, you'll be able to see everything 16:30 I will give you that is the best advice I've heard in a very long time. I have heard of the Marco Polo app, because my wife uses it to talk to my in laws. Yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about. But that is so brilliant. It's brilliant. So brilliant. Yeah, I'll have to, I'll have to 16:49 tell my brother. I'll show this to him. Because Because God's honest truth is his idea. I just build systems behind everything. So if anybody gives me any idea, any inkling of an idea, I'm gonna build a system that I can 1,000x behind that idea. So I'll definitely he'll definitely be watching this and like, cheering along, because it was it was definitely his brainchild. 17:11 Now that one that one's I've never in my life heard that one. I'm using that for real estate. But that one's definitely gonna be a key point that I'm might have to find a way to utilize because that one that one's huge. It's huge, because the miscommunication is what drives so many problems. Yeah, this communication with everything, 17:31 everything, everything. And the reason why for for some of us who who might be watching this, in our little less sophisticated is, look, if your uncle taught you how to build houses, you're and he's from, like, let's say, Ecuador, right. And then my uncle taught me how to build houses. And he's from Jamaica, they call things different things. So they might have called sheetrock a different thing, or this tool, a different thing or that tool, a different thing. So when you go to Home Depot to get something, you might say, Go get me XYZ, and you're gonna use a certain lingo, but if you're talking to the wrong person, they're gonna get the wrong thing, or not know what you're talking about. And that miscommunication, you have to multiply that by every day, maybe 4050 times per day, this is happening within your operation. And it creates such a slowdown of efficiency. This is why you can't get your rehab to 12 weeks or less. That's why and there's no other way around it, but to solve it. So it's really getting into the weeds of what is slowing these guys down and solving them one by one. So it's very, it's a very powerful strategy. It's a it's like a foundational tool, I would say that you need there are other things I use, but that's the foundation. 18:46 So what other tools do you use? Because that will download my mind. 18:51 Now, definitely, I think, I think a lot of us don't use, we don't know, we don't use the right security system. So if you're rehabbing properties like I do, I'm in blighted neighborhoods, so I'm gonna see class neighborhoods, I might be in Baltimore, I might be in Philly. I'm in places where sometimes, you know, depending on the time of year somebody might break into your house. And realistically, I mean, somebody will steal your packages off your porch in the suburbs, right? People break in everywhere. A lot of us don't know the difference between, you know, like the right type of security, so you have to put security cameras on your property. There are things like wise camps that are very cheap, $25 per camera, they have like a $5 upgrade, where they'll video monitor your properties and call the cops if somebody breaks in and just little efficiencies like that will save you more money I learned by putting like security grills and doors on my properties from companies like one is called dogs. One is called V VPS vacant property solutions. These are like the guys who will go into Detroit when they're like torch and how stairs and stuff, and they'll just bang them up like steel doors, steel window guards still put a guard on the chimney, like whatever they got to do. But the problem with those is, they will make your property less likely to get broken into because there's more work that needs to be done. It's kind of like, you know, the easiest property to break into is gonna get broken into first. But there's nothing like that camera, especially if you're in a city, where the police response time is very quick, like in Philly, if you break into one of my properties, and I call the cops, they'll be there in two minutes, you can't do much damage to my property in two minutes, I don't care who you are, it's gonna take your time to break things apart and steal copper lines, it takes time. So that camera can be more valuable than even putting steel doors, steel cages, and guards all over your property. So we just need to know the difference to have that remote access and control. But it's cheaper to put on your property than it is to get robbed, you get robbed $4,000, you put the security on your property $400 And you can take it off and take it to the next deal. So a lot of these security systems are really important as well and giving you that remote access to see your property, see who's in it, who's coming and going. You're also going to use that to see what contractors are coming and going. And when they're arriving to the property to do work. And when they're leaving for the day. Especially if you're paying for day labor, sales. A lot of this stuff is important. It all all these systems are important they all intertwine. 21:27 That's such a good point. I grew up I grew up outside Chicago and Chicago is nuts. 21:35 Yeah, no, it's definitely the wild, the Wild West, the wild Midwest, 21:39 the wild Midwest is like people, people that have never seen it firsthand can't understand 21:46 or appreciate it. Yes, like 21:50 us. It's crazy man. Detroit, Chicago, Ohio, it's gonna be rough man, Billy, it's gonna be rough. It's gonna be rough. Usually, if you're an investor, you can, you can be carrying around a lot of those. around you, you're hopefully you're done. 22:10 Yeah, and that's another reason why you want to you want to invest in those areas with with proper mentorship, especially if you're not from there, you want to do it with somebody who can show you how to navigate. Because in every bad neighborhood, there's a good section and every good neighborhood, there's a bad section. So you just need to know how to pick the right areas to invest in to do that value add investing, and there's a right way to do it and a wrong way to do it. But in these rougher pockets, we all know that the cap rates are more favorable, their wider profit margins is there's more juice more meat on the bone. So it's a more profitable way to invest when you're just getting started. And also, when you buy a property for 50 $60,000, there's a strong chance that it could triple in value. When you buy a property for half a million dollars, just from an American average american affordability standpoint, there's less of a chance that that's going to triple in value. Because it's all about the affordability for the average American, which is a multiple of the median income. Once you get past 6x on the median income of any area, that housing actually is becoming in bubble territory, not affordable for the average American. And once you get beyond that, it's not long before those prices kind of come back down. Especially during times like you know, a recession where things get tighter, so so it's definitely a good way to invest. 23:32 Are most of your tenants or Isaiah, you must be a section 800%. So actually, 23:37 I started off 100% section eight, and it got too slow for me, like section eight has made incredible efficiencies now and they've gone super tech friendly and filly like they're, I mean, these people are unrecognizable from what I had to deal with when I started dealing with Section Eight. But I found the process to still be too slow to scale, especially as I started, you know, having years where I was doing over 100 deals in a year. It's like hey, I have too much of a tentative backlog. So I started to get into a new strategy called co living and it's kind of so new that most people still don't know it exists. But what we'll do is we'll take a property like a three bed one bath, blow it up and rebuild it into a three bed three bath three master suites, you can only get to the bathroom through each individual bedroom and you can rent out each suite like a like a studio, they share the kitchen a little common eat in kitchen common area, and that could take your rent on a property like a three bed one bath and reference well 50 a month. Each co living suite will rent for 750 a month. So it takes your rent from 1250 to 2250 on the same footprint of a property. So from a cash flow standpoint, this is going to two or 3x your cash flow. You can make $1,000 a month on a single family property and you know a top 10 city in America with This cold living strategy and it creates affordable housing. So it's one of the purest solutions to the affordable housing crisis. You don't need low income housing tax credits, you don't need vouchers, you don't have to qualify. And it directly taps into those millions of Americans that are living on their parents couch or in the basement. Yeah, right, you're finding a 25:18 solution to that 100%. That's, that's really, really smart. I know you're gonna answer this, but do people put you in the middle with because now they have particularly roommates, and you didn't always get along? Do you kind of like combine them based off of thing are you just kind of roll the dice and 25:41 you're a daredevil, then definitely roll the dice. But the best way to do it is to, is to do personality testing. So do some personality testing. You don't want any dark triads in there just, you know, recommend house, but also do like to like, like, you don't want to put the 65 year old retiring, you know, divorcee in with like, the 30 year old, you know, working class woman who's like partying a little bit and doing different things, they're living different lifestyles, you want to keep it like a woman's house and a man's house, but also have similar ages, similar backgrounds, kind of, you know, weeding through some of those issues. And then you have to set your house rules. So you have to do what I call, which is kind of like a sales tactic in sales, you would want to answer objections before they're asked, and then do like presetting it with a tenant, and you want to do a lot of that as well. You want to test your tenant before they move in, and you want to level set. So it's just like, hey, you know, a lot of us will have to evict people because we don't level set on the beginning, I'll scare away a tenant, before I have to evict them, I'll just say, hey, look, we run a tight ship here. So if you're the type of person who doesn't pay, you shouldn't come here, because the rents due on the first by the fifth, it's late, we send a pay or quit notice by the 15th. And you know, we file. So is that is that going to be a problem for you? And they're gonna think like, wow, that would probably be a problem for me. And they won't move in a lot of the people, you also have to do more background checks. But it's there's a lot of level setting with how you talk and how you preset before somebody moves in. But if you do all the right things, you can eliminate a lot of the issues, and you typically will just have people who go and live and pay their rent, and it's fine. So it's just a cash cow. 27:29 So I like I like I've never heard I've heard this, like I've heard of it before, but I've never heard of somebody actually taking up the scale to actually do all the houses. So one of the caveats is yes, you do make more cash flow, but you actually have more you actually have more tenants. 27:46 Well, yeah, so yeah, let's talk about that. So you have more cash flow, you have more tenants. So how do I solve this equation? More cash flow per property, like a lot more cash flow per property, more tenants, so potentially more headaches? Well, I'm just going to hire some virtual assistants with the more cashflow. Okay, and the virtual assistants can answer the phone rings, and they can manage at a higher level than I could, or than a typical property management company could. So with two virtual assistants, that might get $1,000 A month each, which is like two properties. If I scale this to a portfolio, they can manage 100 properties, just the two of them. They can manage 300 300 tenants easy. So 28:29 yeah, yep, full time staff available. And there, they call somebody answered every time, 28:33 every time. So you just you over, you swarm your problems, like that's the best thing to do in real estate, and really any business, it's just swarm your problems with good talent. Don't try to be a hero, you will burn out, I don't care who you are, I don't care how much coffee you drink, what your workout routine is, you will burn out like the rest of us. And that's the difference between me and you is like I'm I know, I'll burn out. So I'll just hire the people and scale the operation around my team. And know that, hey, I'm just an individual I might be have some superpowers in terms of system building. But I'm an individual like everyone else. So even when I burn out, I still have 100 people that are cranking. 29:14 Are you self managing 100%? Yeah, like, 29:18 here's the here's the, I guess the paradox. Most of us think, when we get into real estate, I'm going to self manage until I get 10 properties. And when I have 10 properties, then I'll hand it over to property management. And other than that, and what happens is, when you get those first 10 And you self manage, you're building a business that requires self management. From a financial standpoint, you never priced in the cost of property management, and you will never want to you won't have built that muscle. So the real way you should do it is to have property management on your first 10 properties. It's going to allow you to scale faster, you're gonna get mailbox money where you don't have to answer the phone, there's less distractions you won't burn out and then one You get those 10, you have enough money coming in, in that 10%? Well, you could hire a virtual assistant to manage all those 10 Fire the property management company in the scale. And that's the way you should do it. You should do it in reverse. You should self manage when you have more, not less. But most, most of us don't know that. That is 30:18 another great advice for re listening. I'm going to key in on this advice for everybody here because self managing like, like you said, you have two full time employees answer the phone. That's the best type of self management. Like the 30:34 highest not even self management. 30:37 Property Manager, they will not answer the phone every time they'll put some of the voicemail, the text in a ticket email me this this like that. But you have two full time bas answer the phone. That is that is the best tip I've heard in a long time for property management for everybody to hear. Like, yeah, now listen that part again. You'll get it when you get there. 30:57 Yeah, you'll definitely get it it This is awful. All makes sense at different points of the of the journey. But when it clicks like this, this stuff is I went through a lot of pain for this stuff. I've lost over half a million dollars to get to this type of knowledge. 31:13 Well, that's the that's the part like people like why would I pay for mentorship, like, well, because I paid a physical cash. 31:19 They don't tell you this about the school of hard knocks, you think, Oh, I would pay for mentorship, I'll just go through the school of hard knocks, the school of hard knocks is 100x the cost of mentorship, not to X not 3x, not 10x 100x the cost of mentorship. So if you're smart, you'll just pay for mentorship and skip all of the pain and just learn from somebody else's. But if you want the school of hard knocks, you know, just be prepared to spend a ton of money trying to figure this thing out and go through a lot of pain. I don't recommend it. 31:50 Yeah, it's a it's a it's a painful lesson. Every time you wholesale your deal. And the flipper makes 150 grand you're like 32:00 Yeah, exactly. 32:03 It's things a little bit the $30,000 wholesale fee. 32:08 Yeah, that does. It does. 32:13 So how are you? So as a question, I'm kind of having this is such a great conversation to have, like, My questions are building up. So I want to remember the what I just thought of right now. But before I forget, so what stops a lot of people from building up a portfolio or getting to the level urs capital. So what's what's the capital? Like? Requirements? Capital, not the cap requirement, but the capital muscle you built to get to this point? Because Okay, definitely a capital. Capital muscle you 32:44 built for sure. There? Yeah, there's a the biggest the biggest muscle you guys have to build is you have to understand you're gonna hear the word no. You got to become like a baby with this thing. Like, I have a I have a three year old and a one year old. I might say no. I say no. So many times a day. My youngest, his first word was No, he's like, no, no, no, no, no, he wags his finger. But you hear no, as a baby. They don't care. You can say no. And they look you right in the face. And they try again and again and again until they get the Yes. And if you kept that childlike attitude with real estate, you understand? You're gonna hear no from lenders all the time. No, we won't fund that deal. No, we won't do this. Well, have you thought about this? Have you thought about that? Why not? Who do you have to go to for approval? And eventually, if you keep prying, you will get the Yes. And only takes one? Yes. to 100x your business? One? Yes. that I got at some point was no, we won't use your appraiser on your initial, you know, hard money loan for the for the refinance. We won't do it. We just don't do it. Why not? Why not? We won't do it. And eventually, somebody said, yeah, we'll use the same appraisal. Oh, so that took away appraisal risk from my entire birth strategy. Yeah. So now if I'm competing against somebody who does have appraisal risk, and I have none, I can run 10 times faster than you because I could still take out $2 million with construction loans. Knowing for absolute fact that I can exit those at a 80% LTV cash out refinance. I'm getting paid to build now. So you only need one magical yes to accelerate. But most of us stop at the first No, we just stop because we believe that it's final it's never final. And just because this person says no doesn't mean the next guy is gonna say no. You don't care about the no you're looking for the yes, 34:35 you can go back six months later and that might be a yes. And that's 34:39 happened to I've had a no I've had the underwriter won't approve this. And then it's like hey, we'll take our business elsewhere and they come back they see you're still standing in six months and they're like, Look, you were sorry. These things happen. But you you have to be the one to not accept no for an answer. Never accept no for an answer in real estate or in any business, just find your yes and keep plugging away. And that is the biggest muscle. Because it's a it's an aha moment. You think, oh, I'm only going to hear no. And that's the end of it. And then when you get that, yes, you're like, Wait, what was the approval process? Oh, there's just three guys in a boardroom. And they just decided, that's how it works. That's how it works. That's how it works at the highest companies. Oh, this is our rules. This is how we do things here. And there's no way that can go. There's three guys in a boardroom. And they say, How much money can we make? And I mean, if you take away his appraisal risk, and he does 5 million worth of deals, and we're charging three points. I mean, we can make a couple 100,000. All right, it was the end of it, and then they do it. So because lenders would rather deal with a repeat business. It's like the Drake's on, like, no new friends, lenders hate new investors, they hate new friends, they'd rather deal with the investor that they've dealt with before, that has paid them before that is executed before that didn't get burned by the contractor. So once you've established the relationship, keep pushing for more. That's an that's another level of not taking no, even if you hear no upfront, do a deal with the lender, then bring it back up. Hey, I know you wouldn't do this before. But now we got this deal done. You guys should be a little bit more comfortable. Can you do it now? Can we can we roll the closing costs? And accrued? Put those into the loan now? So that we can come to the table with less money? Can we capitalize those? Can we collateralize? The closing costs? Well, we never thought about that. Well, what do you think about it, you start asking these questions and pushing, pushing, always be pushing, always be trying to get ahead, because this is how you get ahead of the competition by pushing these buttons and creating custom strategies that you have that nobody else has. Because you got exceptions. That's how. So that's the muscle is getting comfortable with that pushing. 36:53 This is this has been my favorite interview in a long time. Because we're on the same page here. Like, we don't do the same thing. But we do the same thing in our own little way. So like the partner we talked about, we talked to we talked about when we're talking negotiate with sellers, we hit all the buttons in the elevator like a kid. Don't know what they're gonna say. And you just said it right. Now. Let me go on the ask him this. Can you do this? Can you do that? Can you do this? Well, I might do that if you do this. Okay. Okay. What if we did this, this and this to get that? Yeah, I didn't even think about that. Let Yeah, let's do that. Yeah. 37:25 How does that work? Again, this is how you know, you start getting there. But you have to ask that question. You have to go there. And most, so many people are afraid to go there. Because of that, that nine to five mindset, that whole matrix mindset. You're just used to just complying versus thinking outside of the box and free thinking with this stuff. There's no limits to this thing. 37:46 And this is where like this is where your your knowledge, your knowledge base comes in. Because if you don't if you know, to hit that button, every time you have a conversation, you hit that button every time but if you don't even know that question exist, 37:58 you're That's it. That's it, if you don't even know to ask, then you just can never get there. And that's, that's where that mentorship comes in. Somebody who's been around that and scaled up, you know, I've been on the on the phone with your mom and pop lenders all the way to JP Morgan. So it's like, where did those questions come up? What's behind the veil? Do the lenders even have money? Are they getting a line from a larger Land Trust? Who's buying debt and giving them $100 million line? Most of your lenders out there, they only have a million dollars, one to 5 million and then they have they bought a credit line 50 million for the line? They're ordering the money to close your loan? Why do you think they can't close right away, because they got to order the money from the credit the warehouse line. Like they don't even have any money and all that and then the guy who has the money is some old guy with a 401k. They're just taking the money out there. Like it's really, you know, my section eight property might end up in your 401k. And the results of your 401k are based upon my ability to manage a section eight tenant and screen them and not get foreclosed on. Like it's really that serious because there's so many veils behind this lending game. Nobody has any money. It's crazy. And nobody knows how to underwrite. It's a it's a weird, it's a weird business. As you pull back the veil is really, it's really a, you understand The Big Short a lot better as you pull back the veil of this stuff. 39:29 Okay, this is we're getting into some touchy territory here. This is where I live and I love talking about it. Because one thing that I think you're really you're really touching is the money connection doesn't know anything about real estate or tenants or nothing like that. So as that bridge lender that doesn't have any money. That's the money that hey, I understand a little bit or understand what numbers look like. And then there's another person like Yeah, I know somebody who's doing deals. Let me connect you with let me connect you with Brian here. Now Brian comes in. Hey, I Doing this, this, this this, okay, and then it connects all the bridges together. And just for connecting the dots, 40:06 that middleman get paid for connecting. And that's the scariest part. And that was a beautiful way to that you laid it out is perfectly crystal clear and absolutely correct. The scariest part is I know how to underwrite deals better than the lender, who's given me the millions, they think they know better than me. So they'll argue with me, oh, the deal is not going to cost that much based on what I mean, I'm building houses right now. I'm counting receipts, I'm tracking data, based on what these lenders don't know how to underwrite. The real person who should be underwriting the deals is me, you because I'm doing it. So they're basically the big Land Trust has no idea what's going on in Philly. So they hire the bridge lender or the micro construction lender, because they think they know what they're doing. And they convinced them they know what they're doing. But they really don't, they really have no idea. Most of the people there, they've never built a property in our life. They just thought lending is a good business and short term lending is profitable, because you can charge 13% rates and three points we're getting so yeah, so it's a, it's really, it's really bizarre, it becomes fascinating to not, you know, in this business, you can work in it. And there's so much coming at you that you're working in the business. But when you step back to work on it, and kind of look at it, it's really fascinating how the money moves. And once you understand that these people don't really know that much about underwriting and what's really going on, you start pushing them to create products that facilitate ease, because these in their attempt to be conservative, they actually create more risk, like a lender will do something like this, I want you let's say you have $50,000. And you were going to do a rehab project, and they could give you the money to rehab the project, they're gonna say, I want you to put $30,000 into the deal. So you have more skin in the game. And you say, well, that's fine. But then I have less money to rehab. Rehab the project? Isn't that more dangerous for both of us? Doesn't that put me in a closer position, if anything goes wrong, where I'll default, and you have no idea how to build this house either. So then you'll default. And then like, isn't that bad. But the lenders they just can't see clearly. So they think no, I'm being more conservative for me. But you can't put me the developer in a worse position and be more conservative, it doesn't work like that, you have to put me in the best position to finish this deal. That makes it easier for you and more likely that you'll get paid. But it's like, because they don't understand these things can just get really hairy. And that's why I push people to make better products that actually make sense and make things safer for both parties. And when you show them how it's safer. They'll actually wake up and say, Ah, that is actually pretty comfortable. Let's make the exception just for them, though. Because I don't want to do this at scale yet. And that's how you'll get it. Yeah. 43:03 You're really making me think of a title because I feel like this is perfect conversation to bridge that gap. So I have to like title it or reach the right audience. 43:10 going a mile deep here, we're going a mile deep and 43:14 this is so it's such I love this conversation. I really, really do because like that 30,000 lenders asked me before that can be payments. So make sure your stick you stay in it. That can be something an accident comes up that you never see or somebody still you stay in the deal. Because, yes, you're doing the deal. Yes, there's risk involved, but you don't want you want as much you want to you want it to be as safe as possible to complete the transaction because you're not doing this for fun. 43:44 Exactly. Exactly. And you're taking on serious risk. You're, you're personally guaranteeing loans, you're doing a lot of things and you want to have a comfortable cash position. So that that brick wall actually needs to be demoed and reframed up, you have a vast ability to do it. You only have an extra 10k to do it. Even if you take that loss on a total project. Just getting to the finish line is a completion of the job. It's a W from a lender perspective. You got them cashed out of the deal, and you can do more deals and make up that money because this is a multimillion dollar game. Losing 10 grand on one deal you make 100 grand on the next day, it all goes together. It doesn't matter. Yeah, yeah. No, you're 44:24 right. That's this is such a great conversation because it's the This is why like our preferred lender in Texas, he's very flexible because he actually isn't in the business. Yeah, those are the best guys. Those are the best lenders out there just because they understand. They understand what it really takes to get the deal done. And they know how to do it. If they ever need to foreclose and do the job. They can do it because they're in it to 44:51 they can step in. Yeah. And that's you know, that's a you want to work with a lender that gets it because the lenders that don't get it there They're gonna, they're gonna collapse deals, eventually they'll fail. And you don't want to be a part of that, you know, type of operation. So it's, it's hard to know this when you're new and you're doing your first couple deals. But as you scale you, you start to pick some preferred lenders and like you said, stick with them, like they're your go to. And my last point on lending is, even when you have your go to another scale point is to diversify your lenders, because you can quickly with your go to lender become 30 40% of their fund, and at some point, they're gonna cut you off, they're gonna say, We're gonna cut you off. Now, if they cut you off, and you've got 10 properties under contract that need to close in a month. You don't want to lose 10 contracts. What is that going to do to you representationally with the different wholesalers and realtors, so you need diversification even within your lenders. Or if they had 10 loans go bad, and now their liquidity is crunched with their warehouse line. You need you need some diversification because because it's all a business. Here's a fun. Here's a fun fact. Fun story. I had a guy, there was a guy, and he went to sleep, march, march 2020. We'll call it like the first of March 2020 pandemic shutdown, he goes to sleep he's got a $10 million cash out refinance closing the next day. He wakes up drinks a cup of coffee he does his routine gets a phone call, Hey, how are we doing on that refi the land trust they're not buying debt anymore. The whole market shut down the whole non QM market to refi is dead. Click that's how this game is is dirty man. I've seen like I've seen it's a when it gets ugly. When it rains, it really pours in this game. So you need diversification because I've seen deals, multi million dollar deals 10 million cash out. So it was a $50 million loan. 10 million of it was a cash cash out refi was gonna go directly into his pocket, tax free, killed, killed at the table. Moments before completion. This stuff happens. You don't hear about it. But it happens. I thought I was having a bad day. And then I heard this story. I was like, Oh my God. It's all about perspective. The bad days only get bigger the bigger you get. Yeah, yeah. So it gets it gets real, real hideous out here. So you know, keep it in perspective. But diversify. Trust me, you will there will come a point where you wish you did within his game, especially on in lending. And 47:38 yeah, that that, I guess said, so many key points to break apart there. There was, there was a lot of gems in there, just because like you don't you, the lender isn't going to have you be their number one person that they lend out to because they're gonna have to diversify, too, because if you ever go bankrupt or anything happens, you 47:57 fund collapses or fund collapses, they got some splainin to do to their investors. But then how they got so big with one guy, 48:05 then the then the other thing that you really mentioned too, was sometimes there's crunch on them on their side that they can hear that they can even like, like, hey, shit rolls downhill, bro, I'm sorry. 48:17 rolls downhill. It's the whole money chain that you explain this guy has the money he lends to this guy, this guy to this guy. Well, this guy stops buying. He gets he gives a phone call to it's a billion dollar guy stops buying he calls the 100 million dollar guy, they call your $5 million lender and then they call you. And that's how it rolls. Hay the you know, they cut the water off over here. So now it's just you know, it's a small little drip. You know, at this point, there's no money. So it'll it'll dry up in a heartbeat. So you just have to you have to know how this game works on a macro level before you dive in headfirst. 48:54 And this is this is very high level for everybody listening. This is very high level of the of the back office. 49:00 Yeah, yeah, it's, it's fun. It's fun for the guys who are scaling though, because some people are thinking about, hey, I want to go out and get 50 properties and I want to scale I already have you know, 510 properties. This is that next, you know level where you're going it can be highly profitable, but there are some landmines you need to navigate. And if you don't if you don't have your eyes open to these things, you could get beat over the head. I mean, it's it's as serious as a heart attack. 49:27 Okay, that I'm really deadly, man. I really got to be talking about this because that was that was a lot. 49:33 Yeah, it was a lot. I'm glad we unpack this somehow. I don't know how we got here, but I'm glad we're here. 49:40 Oh, man. This is man this. This is good. I want to keep it going. And we'll see where we go next. Okay, so we had a question I had earlier I forgot it already seen. So burr strategy. How many how many units do you have to right now? 49:59 Over 300 properties. So after a while you stop counting to a degree. And it just becomes focused on, you know, activity and building, but I'm always building houses. Right now I'm building houses for myself, I'm building properties for some of my mentees as well, some people who like to flip, I'm not, I'm not against flipping, or strictly buy and hold, I'm more of an opportunist. So I like to treat it like sports react to the market. If in basketball, I was taught, if they're to feed off, you shoot the ball, if they're right up on you drive around them. So in in real estate, it's like, you know, if the market is hot, and pricing is going up, maybe you do a flip, and cash out, especially when rates are high, if rates are coming back down, like they're projected to do, as we get later into, like, 2023 2024, then you start doing the buy and hold heavily again. But I'm building houses for my people, building houses for myself, I just, my real passion in this game is just keeping food on the table, keeping my contractors busy. Facilitating spreading the wealth around and rebuilding communities is really what I love to do. So I'm not selfish with it. If I can help people and build houses for him, then you know, I facilitate that. And I have a program where I do that for my people. 51:20 No, I commend you for that. Because the bigger you get in business, the more people you really realize you're feeding and it's a it's a it's a good flow of energy throughout the 51:32 market. Yes, yeah, it's you're creating jobs, there's no way to scale this thing, this residential real estate thing, and not create or commercial, and not create hundreds of jobs for contractors, you're putting properties back on the payroll for the municipality, you're putting families and properties there in the community spending money at the local bodegas and the corner stores. And you know, you're just creating, you're a part of that economy and that energy. And there's a reward just for providing that amount of value to the universe, in essence, so I just stay stuck in that. I mean, I love the energy of it. And I love seeing people kind of get properties and break their self out of the nine to five and just build generational wealth. I just love real estate ownership. Yeah, 52:19 it says such a cool feeling. Because you you, when you hit a certain point, you can feel the scale of 52:24 the impact. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. If you go into a neighborhood, I don't care what it is how blighted it is, you go in there and build 200 properties in that in that zip code, you won't be able to stand at one property, you could throw a football hit another property you own. When you have that type of feeling, you'll start to see neighborhoods change. But even more than that, what if you could build 5060 other developers and they all buy him next to you and beside you. And across the town or across the country, you'll learn about new markets and everywhere is getting built out. That's where you can really dominate. If you took 10 developers into one zip code in Baltimore, you guys could flip the whole zip code, property value go from 60 70,000 per property, to 220 to 30. And you guys would just crank out that developer spread all as a collective, there's so much food to be eaten. All these major cities were built in the 1910s 1920s. They're all 100 years old, everything's falling apart. So once you learn how to put them back together, there's infinite opportunity, how a new house is falling down every day, and will be for the foreseeable future. So it's a multimillion dollar skill set that you're building by getting into this 53:37 thing. Yeah, 100%. Ma'am. How do you foresee next year, like the real estate market? What's the what's the transition point where, and I really, I'm really getting mentioned earlier, too, that you kind of ebb and flow with the market. What do you feel 2023 is looking like, 53:54 I think it's such a, I'm like an econ major from, you know, Columbia. So this is this stuff just fascinates me. But I'm looking at it and saying, the Fed look in every recession in US history, the way out has been quantitative easing, reducing interest rates, every recession, US history. So unless this is going to be the one recession in US history, where we don't which I don't think it's the case, at some point the Fed is going to about face and start to reduce rates, which is probably going to be tail end of 2023 at the earliest, but definitely by 2024. So we've been in this decreasing interest rate environment, where it's always made sense to do like a 30 year fix. And some of the arms like the seven one arm the five one ARM have made no sense. And I think right now, if you're projecting that mid term rates are going to reverse some of these seven year five year arms actually make more sense because you could put a seven year annual renewable mortgage on it, you know, after that seven year lockup period, it's going to reduce your rate, you know, a point a point and a half today. So that's the difference between Six and a half percent and five, five and a quarter, which is cashflow, if you're doing a buy and hold or a burr strategy, and then refinance out of that later as rates go back down. So there's some interesting strategies with rate by downs or to one rate by downs and all these different strategies out there that weren't valuable for the last 10 years. So these are things that we need to explore. And then I talked to my people about, from a pricing standpoint, prices actually aren't falling as fast as we thought they were, they're going down in a lot of the metros, I think as of October of 2020, to 90% of 95% of us metros had actually continued to increase in value, year over year, just not by as much as they were, they were going up 18% year over year. Now it's like 2%, back with normal long term inflation. So it feels stagnant, we're seeing more properties stay on market longer. So inventory is picking up prices are falling is it's a buyers market, again, almost everywhere. So it's a good time, I think we're in a window, long story short a window, where if you keep your eye on the ball, it's a buyers market, you can tap in and lock in some properties at lower values than they would be and get these locked in at the new low interest rate, I don't think we're going back to 3%. But you can get it locked in at maybe 4.5 4.75, depending on the strategy that you do. And when you lock in a mortgage. And there's going to be like a year, year and a half window where prices are low, as rates get reduced. For us to get out of this recession, prices are going to keep going back up. And you're gonna miss that window. It's just like the stock market, most people do what sell high and sell low and buy high and sell low, they lose their money, right. So most people are going to sit on the sidelines and say, I'm going to time the bottom of the market prices are going to fall. And I'm just going to miss the window because they're not going to fall as far as you think they are. And then rates are going to about face and you're gonna miss that window. So I think there's going to be a gap that most people won't see. And for the people who are tapped in, they're gonna get some properties and cash in on this opportunity. 57:14 What is a quote that is yours or somebody else's that you resonate with? 57:21 There's a quote, I don't want to say the, I think this is a Frank Sinatra code is not how good you're doing is how long you're doing good. And it's such a good quote. Because as you're as you're building out your business, look, we're all in this social media age where you're gonna compare yourself to other people who are doing very well right now, or are giving off the projection that they're doing very well. But it's not how long there is not how good they're doing. Now, you want to set up your business for the long term to be doing good for a long time, how long you're doing good, you want to set yourself up forever. That's the goal of this thing. So don't get distracted by all the shiny stuff you see on Instagram, YouTube, shorts, and you know, tick tock and all these different platforms, stay locked in on your mission build for the long term, set yourself up to do good for long, don't make those costly mistakes. And don't try to move too fast. Don't try to move too fast through this game. Just stay locked in, take your time and set yourself up for the long haul. So that's one of my that's one of my favorite quotes for like life. I would say that it's 58:29 a good one. It's a good 110 years in the business shows your your wisdom in the game. 58:36 No, definitely. And I've been around the block. So I'm pretty crafty man. I'm a I'm an ultimate hustler. So I will. You know, I love this thing too. I'm doing my passion. But like I said, I'm adaptive. So they're it's hard to one thing I've learned is when you provide a lot of value to people in the universe is hard to get put out, man, because the universe wants you to win. It wants you to because you're just providing value and helping other people to put food on the table and create generational wealth. So I stay tapped into that. And I think that protects me from some of the hardships and falls that are out there. The pitfalls? 59:13 Yeah, it's like it's like the good karma thing. You produce the results. And somehow you get good results around you. 59:19 Yeah, yeah, you keep good energy and good things will happen for you. For sure. 59:24 Yeah, it's people think it's superstitious or like he's lucky. No, no, no, not really. 59:31 Not quite. And it there's some work involved in it and keeping your energy right and keeping your focus, right. And there's definitely some work in it. But it's a it's definitely more rewarding than you know, being miserable all day or hating your job and your boss. Sometimes you got to bet on yourself, even if it looks daunting, and just trust that that net will appear. 59:54 Yeah, that's that's always the win, win. Never like that. I see that all the time too. It's just like, entrepreneurship is jumping off the cliff open the hope and the parachute open up. Hopefully Yeah. 1:00:07 Ya know, my, my mentor, one of my mentors, he's business partners like Magic Johnson, TD Jakes, he does commercial real estate all across the country with like big celebrities. And he gave me a book when I was like 24. And it was just like, different quotes, like a picture book with quotes. He's like, Here, take it, and one of them was jumping in net will appear. And there's a picture of a guy jumping off a cliff. And it was just clouds, you couldn't see anything. You were too high up to see the net. But you had to trust that the net was down there. And like a, like a, one of the circus like trapeze artists like it will catch one bounce you back up and prop you back up and allow you to climb higher. So you just have to jump in trust that the net will appear. And I really took that to heart and I jumped into entrepreneurship and the nine and out of the nine to five and trusted that then net will appear for me. And it did. Yeah, 1:01:01 I did the same thing too. Yeah. Long Way Down, though. 1:01:05 Yeah, it could be a long way down. I mean, you're gonna you're gonna feel some different emotions on the way down. But now, it'll usually support you, it'll usually support 1:01:15 you. Um, I think I know the answer to this one. But how do you deal with burnout? 1:01:23 I just reset man, like, I'm lucky I don't have many vices. So I'm one here's how I deal with burnout is the real truth how I deal with burnout is when I'm not burned out, I'm a monster, I run with the energy all the time. So if the energy is burnout, I recharge. Well, when I'm feeling it. I'm cranking content, I'm cranking houses out, I'm doing everything. So I've run like a bear out of hell, when, when I'm like juiced up and fired up. And then when I burn out, I know that if I just rest, I'm gonna hit that sprint again. So I'm like the guy who runs and waits for the second wind, like I'll just burn out and wait for that second wind. And there's always a second wind, I've been knocked down enough times to know that I'm undefeatable, like, I will get back up, that energy will come back, and then I'm going to run as far as I can with that baton, until I drop it. And then I'll take a breather, and then I'm gonna run as far as I can. So I just go with it. Like, I don't fight it. I'll just recharge and then come back. 1:02:29 I really liked what you said there, because I feel people struggle all the time. But it's the ebb and flow of everything, like burnout is gonna be there. And it's kind of come like the way kind of like, picture that I was like, it's going to come just got to deal with it. And then whenever you just got to read that when the energy comes up again. 1:02:47 Yeah, the problem is when you when you fight, you try to fight burnout, you know, your burnout, but you try to fight through it, then you start producing bad products, you really should just take that time of take the step back, that's part of being an entrepreneur. The problem with entrepreneurship is you don't have a boss, you don't have a schedule. So you can run yourself into the ground. Or some people don't know how to program themselves, so they don't get enough done. But when you get it, right, you push yourself as hard as you can be pushed when you have the most energy. And when you don't, you rest as hard as possible. So you rest totally you turn, turn everything off, rest totally and you will recharge faster. It's self regulation, self regulation, trust your body. trust it, you know, it's telling you something for a reason. If you find it too hard, you'll get sick anyway. You know, and then you're done. You're out anyway. So you might as well just listen and take that time and take that nap. Take that power nap do it every time you can. And you'll get more production out of yourself. 1:03:53 Man, where can people find you online? Man, this is such a been a great interview. I love the conversation. I have to get you back on again for sure. 1:04:00 Yeah, this is great. You can find me. I'm like everywhere on Tik Tok Brian Grimes EST on tick tock on YouTube. Brian loves cash flow. That's easy to remember because I love cash flow. So Brian loves cash flow on YouTube. On Instagram Brian Grimes underscore 247 Cfu for the 24/7 cash flow University. And you can find me on like LinkedIn, Brian Grimes real estate. All of these channels are back link to my free training that I have for you guys on www dot work with grymes.com forward slash cashflow work with grymes.com forward slash cashflow, and that'll teach you how to acquire properties for pennies on the dollar all across the country. You don't want to miss out on that free training. So definitely tap in. 1:04:46 So check it out. Everywhere. He just said link will be in the bio. We appreciate you Brian for coming on. Definitely I open conversation I think of the title so I'm still 1:04:58 gonna come to you man trust the energy just meditate on it and it was just appear. 1:05:03 We appreciate you coming on. Please go check them out. This has been a dope interview. If y'all made it this far. leave a review man. This is dope episode was being dope. Yeah, 1:05:15 you guys got to support this. Amazing Alright, 1:05:18 thanks for coming out appreciate y'all see on the next episode
Host/ Ceo/ Speaker
I have been an entrepreneur since 2018. I come from a regular home just like most people. My dad worked on the roads in the Chicago area for over 30 years. He always taught me to work with my brain, instead of my body. Your body can only take so much abuse. I learned so much from my father. He always pushed me to work smarter and not harder.
I have owned and operated a trucking business for 2 years. I started learning real estate in 2019. Fell into the Data & Skiptracing business in 2020. My partner Anthony & I started Hivemind in 2021.
I have done a ton of different jobs coming up from painting, to door-to-door sales, telemarketing, truck driving, and loading trailers. What I learned most is that I want to stay in the digital business space. The leverage you can have delivering digital products to the marketplace can yield limitless possibilites.
I started The List Guys in 2020. It is a data and skiptracing service. We provide seller and buyers list nationwide. My clients have been getting great results and I am proud to help people killing it.
I started the Hive in 2021 with my partner Anthony Gaona. It is a real estate and business mastermind. It also comes with a all in one CRM, that can host unlimited websites and users.
Starting the Hivemind has been an amazing journey so far. Seeing one of our users make his 6 figure month in June 2021 leveraging our software, I know there will be plenty more to come!