Come hive with us!!!
Nov. 9, 2022

Ep 262: Basics Of Doing Large Real Estate Deals With Tim Mai

Ep 262: Basics Of Doing Large Real Estate Deals With Tim Mai


text "course" to learn how to make 6 figures on one land deal, Text "Hive" to get added to weekly meetings. Text "apple" to schedule a 1-on-1 call with Anthony & Daniel. Text "land" to join The Million Dollar Land Mastermind

Sign up at

Need Inbound Real Estate Leads.

Follow Us On YouTube

Follow Us On Instagram

Follow Us On TikTok

Join The FB Group

Help support the show

--- Support this podcast:

0:34 Hey, what's up people out there and real estate land. This is Anthony with the hive mind. This is another episode of the hive with this podcast. Today we have an amazing, amazing guest. I think as the show's continue to go on the guests just keep on getting more and more intense and amazing. So I'm excited about today's we it took us a little while to get this gentleman on the show, but I'm sure he has lots to share. I think where our real estate career and our business careers headed. You're gonna eventually need to learn what this gentleman knows along the way and something that he's taken a big part in. So yeah, I want to introduce everybody to Mr. Tim my. Hey, what's up, man? I think you're muted. 1:22 Testing 123 and hear me. Gotcha now. Yeah. Yay. Perfect. Awesome. Yeah. Well, hey, everybody. Hey, Anthony. 1:32 Awesome, man. Thank you for being on here, man. And one thing I wanted to do is to tell you, thank you too, for always being there whenever I would have you look at stuff and ask for some advice. You were always there to provide support, man. So that means a lot a lot of people are they make themselves unavailable on purpose, which I can respect. But you've done a lot for us. And I appreciate it, man. Thank you. 1:50 Yeah, definitely. You're welcome. Always, you know, always glad to help a fellow investor right in the industry. You know, we learn from each other. I know, I learned a ton from you as well. And so I love I'll always love sharing ideas and learn from each other. We both grow. 2:06 I mean, love the energy, and I appreciate it. Yeah. 2:09 So we kind of spoke offline, but you've been doing this for 20 years. 2:14 Yep. Yeah. So I got started in 2002. After I got laid off from my IT job, you know, back back during days. Yeah, since then, I've done all kinds of deals. I've done a lot of wholesale, a lot of fixing flipping, when the market crashed back in 2008. I had 30 rehabs going on at different stages of that rehab. So I got hit pretty hard during during the last market crash. And but yeah, you know, just just like a lot of entrepreneurs, we bounce back from that and learn from that we grow from that. And yeah, I've I've been blessed I've probably done well over 1000 deals now, you know, throughout the years and in the last I would say three years I was when I transitioned over to the land side of the business so I'm not doing any more fixing flip I'm completely out of that. And yeah, we do a lot I would do a lot of flipping land flips land investing land entitlements. So we are in a Houston Metro and then we've recently expanded into the Dallas and some Austin area as well. 3:29 Well, welcome to the dark side, man. Why don't we start right there real quick. Why did you stop doing like cash flowing assets like houses, right? Because yeah, cash flow. So what would possess you to get in the land? 3:45 Yeah, yeah. So it was completely accidental. What happened was I was at that time I was buying a house and then do an addition turn into a duplex. And then and then the the remodeling for those that construct pretty hefty. I'm like, Okay, well I'm gonna do this much more and spend you know, over $100,000 Just to remodel and do the additions. I should look into building new so I ended up buying I bought a house that has three locks next to it. I bought another house that has two lots next to it. And then And then while I was you know, remodeling the houses to do to turn them into duplexes COVID came and you know, the home construction business got slowed down a lot during during that time. And I was like, Okay, I'm sitting on these lots. You know, let me see if I can sell these lots and and you know, get some get some cash flow. So I ended up selling the lots Long story short, after I finished the house and everything. I made more money on those lots that I did on the house. Oh, wait a minute. I don't have to deal with like evicting tenants. You No city permits on that stuff. All I did was we sell those lots of like, okay, you know, I should I should get into lots. And then I was on. I got on one of John Alexander's call. And, like, on the first five minutes or so he said that, you know, one of the best lists, when it comes to land is out of state owners. I was like, Okay, that's all I needed to know. So I got off, you know, I got off the call, put it out of state on the list, and boom, you know, we did, gosh, the first year and land. Yeah, we did probably over $700,000. What's that strategies? Like? 5:46 It's crazy to hear, because you're not the first person to say that, like, I was doing houses doing houses, and then I actually fell on the land and made more money than all the houses. So you're not the first person to tell us so it's kind of funny to hear. 5:57 Yeah. And I mean, even you know, when I when I sold those slots at that time, like looking back now, like, I should have, you know, sell them for a lot more than I did. So even at the price I did sell them out, you know, and make good money on them. They were they were still on the market. Because at that time, I didn't know what else to do yet. But yeah, so it's good. 6:21 We talked about that yesterday on a podcast that you can't you can't count the dollars looking backwards. And we look at everything we missed out on like, dang, if I know what I know now. Exactly. Shout out to John Alexander. He's hanging out with us right now. Boom. Yeah, man, John's paving the way for a lot of people to get into the land game and the land mogul on Instagram. 6:40 Yeah, you know, I've followed John for a long time, even what his lease purchase stuff back in the old days. So yeah, so John, John been a long, longtime mentor of mine. Sure. Yeah. 6:53 We met him on clubhouse about roughly almost two years ago. Yeah, he's, he's done a lot for us. And he's put a lot of knowledge on the table. And he's always helping people. He's helped a lot of my people get to get deals. He's been with hivemind. Since the beginning. Yeah. So we love John, he's an icon. So let's I want to, I don't know, if you want to talk about this later, if you want to go a little bit into your to what you're doing now and land, how you're operating how your operations are running, I want to talk to you about capital raising at some point, because we're getting to the point to where if we had a little bit of excess capital laying around, we can make some miracles right now. So 7:22 right, yeah, we definitely can talk about that. So, you know, in my business model, we, we acquire a lot of these land, sometimes we use our own money, but a lot of times we use private money to actually close on them, and then you know, we would list them on the MLS, we're able to get more dollars out of it that way. And, you know, we would not really have rushed to sell, right, because we already were very close on it. And so that gives us time, that gives us more ability to negotiate with buyers. And, yeah, in terms of, you know, raising money, you know, especially, depending on the size of the deal, but typically, if it's a million dollars or less, finding private lenders to fund the deal like that, it's fairly easy. There's, you know, have you ever done it, you know, the people listening, I mean, have you ever done fix and flips, you're familiar with that hard money lending type, you know, industry, right type business. And so, a lot of those private lenders, they use lending on houses, they're not that used to lending on land, but if you've done some, some deals with them, and they trust you, they'll, you know, they'll go wherever you want to go, they have that level of trust. So that's what I did, I started talking to my private lenders from all the other lands, or the house flips out and told them, hey, I'm getting into land now. You know, we have different types, that we have the infill lots, which are very easy to do, they, we kept them just like the way we do houses. So the loan on them is very straightforward, nothing much. And then some of the lands that we do that's a little bit more raw, harder to come. But I can certainly just start you with the easy ones so that we get familiar with it and then when we get a bigger deal, that that is not as easy to come at least now you know, how the business works and so, so I have those kind of conversations with them. Some, you know, some say yes, some says no, it's not a big deal you just have in conversation with more people. If you don't have any private lenders, you certainly can talk to some hard money lenders, some will do that. hard money lenders tend to be more expensive, little bit less flexible. But but you know, some of them have a lot of money so they certainly can do it. They'll you know, some every hard money lender is a little bit different but they'll want to see your credit they want to see that you have some money in the bank account for reserves. And, and yeah, I was just a friend of mine has a 55 acres in Nacogdoches and he's looking to buy it and And subdivided into 511 11 acre lots. And so he asked me Hey, Tim, do you know anybody? You know that that would that would, you know, loan on this so that way I can buy and do the do the subdivide, and I hooked them up with a hard money lender? And yeah, I mean, they were willing to lend on it. You know, and so, so yeah, those, you know, those lenders definitely exist. But I would say private lenders is the probably the among the easiest, especially for a lot of the land deals, you're doing bigger deals where you're going to do development and stuff. The kind of capital raising I do these days or syndications for commercial real estate, apartment buildings, typically, you know, the 10 million plus type properties, and so you are having to raise a lot more money. So you poor, instead of, you know, one person, let's say, one person gives you 100,000, you might have, you know, 10 people or 100 people each gives you 100,000. That's what a syndication does. And so, yeah, you don't really need to worry about syndications until you do much bigger deals, like like I have a couple of deals right now that I'm looking to do land development on, so I've closed them with private lenders, when I bought them, and I'm going through the process right now, to get them rezone, you know, getting bids for us, civil engineers, and all of that stuff that we need to do to then do a one of them I'm doing a mixed use. So commercial, rural, commercial on the front, multifamily in the back, another one that's going to be a built subdivision, probably around 100 100, lots or so they are so so in a case like that, I am using private money to buy it, I'm using my own money to, to get it to entitlement phase entitlements, basically, where you get, you know, the rezone, and all of the approval in place. And then once that is done, then I'm doing a syndication to raise money to do the actual development. So as you can see, there's different stages of how you can you can fundraise for these deals, 12:19 man, that's amazing, dude. So I've never put together syndication. But that's so funny that you said that, because I've never heard you say before, but I was gonna text you just a couple of days ago, as I only had to call this guy, I was gonna ask you if he can do that, and how that works. So it pretty simple to go into a little bit of it of how putting that together or 12:35 Yeah, yeah. So I mean, you know, obviously, it's not something that you can do the document on your own. Right. So you do have to hire an SEC attorney to do it costs about $15,000 to do the document. And, yeah, so it's called a private placement memorandum. And, basically, yeah, it basically is the document is like 100 page documents that explain, you know, who's gonna get paid what, who are all part of the transaction? So it spells out all the legalese, right, because it's syndication is similar to selling a security, like, let's say, if you have a company, like a public company, for example, and they raise a bunch of money from the public. And so they're selling securities, the then so that's what basically, that's what syndication is, syndication is just like, a much smaller transaction than a you know, taking a company public, but the process is very similar. And so syndications different from private money is this with a private, hard money, private money, that's a loan, so someone's loaning you money for you to buy for you to buy that, that property, and you're paying them an interest, you know, on that money, syndication, they are investing your company. So, you know, they get shares of your company, basically. And, and so it's not alone, so they get equity, whatever the equity split is, it's very common that people will do a, a, either an 8020 split, what that means is the money partners get 80% of the deal. The general partner who's running the deal gets 20% of the deal. You know, there's other fees that the general partner can charge in that but that's, that's a, that's a common structure. They are more complicated structure, like someone would do, let's say, a, you know, a prep of a prefer interest of let's just say 6% Plus, they're gonna get you know, 50% of the deal on the back end, so they get a little bit of interest and they get equity position. So, this there's a lot of ways to structure syndication, but those are some of the common ways that people do it. And and yeah, it's just, you know, in terms of the actual but outside of the document itself, raising money from the people, it's very similar. You know, it's just that you don't have one private lender to deal with, right? You have however many, depending on the deal, like I said, let's say you generate a million dollars, you know, if you, if you have a private lender that loan you that whole million dollars, you only have one person to deal with. But in a syndication, most likely, no, each person is going to invest 100,000 with you. And so now you have 10 people that you have to work with. But it's scalable, it allows you when people are a million dollars, not a big deal, but when you're doing $10 million deal $100 million deals, then you need that scalability, that a private lender is very hard to find a private lender that will write a check for 10 million or 100 million unless they're big institutional players. But but not, ya know, normal private lenders public and not going to find out so you do have to pull, you know, a bunch of people together. to, to, to invest into your deal. You know, for you to for you to do the deal. 16:12 Yeah, man. So we're gonna have to have that conversation and continue that conversation, I guess another day when we're not on the show, but I sent Tim one that was 80 million. He's like, Yeah, send me the paperwork. I'm taking a look at it might have somebody he wants to play that game. Alright, let's try it and see what happens. That's crazy. Yeah. Yeah, I'm excited about that. It just don't Yeah, yeah. 16:33 You know, I mean, you know, I know you jokingly about it. But you'd be so surprised. This is how it works. Like, when when we play what houses we're playing with 10s of 1000s, maybe hundreds of 1000s. Right? And for us, like, oh, that's normal. Like, we speak that language, right. But let's say for I have I've my son who's 18 years old that I'm training in the business. He did his first landflip actually in fifth with Ian in Houston. But um, you know, for for someone like him, for example, right? When you're talking 100,000 A million, like, for him, that number could be really big. But, right. So it was same thing for us, because we're so used to dealing in the $100,000 range, you know, with when talking about 10s of millions, 100 Millions of seem so really big. But once you start getting into that space, and you get to meet the players that play in that space, it's like, Oh, it's nothing. It's just, it's just another connection that we get to find that plays in that, that that space. So, you know, I say that to say like, if you guys run across big deals, like, you don't have to get scared about it, just know that there are someone out there doing those big deals, and all you need is just that connection to get a hold of that someone and it becomes a normal deal for you. So 17:58 awesome. Things I've worked with them. So that's kind of where we're headed. Next, we're looking at some deals right now. 33 million, 80 million, 20 million. And even though we haven't completed that kind of transaction, I keep saying the same thing. It's like, I'm just glad to like sit at those tables and have those conversations and be on zoom with those people like yourself. So exciting, man excited. I'm gonna keep sending it like that. Yeah, yeah, definitely spot a winner. 18:21 So as far as when you're raising private capital, are you looking for you have to find accredited investors always. And what's the what's the, what's the strategy? How that works? Because a lot of people might not understand that space. 18:34 Yeah. So so if you're talking about so private capital, there's two different kind, right? So when I'm saying private money, just to get some distinction here. So if I'm referring to private money, I'm referring to a private lender, similar to a hard money lender that lands on fixin flip. Okay, so those people know, they don't have to be accredited investors at all. They're just one lender, you know, they're just one person. They are not buying a security in your company, they're loaning the money to you. So the law is a lot, a lot easier on those type of deals. And so that can be anything that can be anyone my very first private lender, when I first started, that was my sister. You know, she, I knew that she had some money sitting in a CD. In case you guys don't know what a CD is, they're not very popular these days anymore, but they used to be a lot more popular certificate of deposits that banks give out. They've been very little. I think at that time, she was earning about 1% interest on her money. And I was like, Well, you have this money in the CD, it's only getting you 1% I can give you at least three times that. So I'll give you 3%. So, so that's a private. That's an example of a private lender. Right? And then when you get over to the syndication side There are different types of syndications they are. And I'm getting into legal easement here. But you guys don't know, don't worry too much about it. But there's a Regulation D 506. B, that will allow up to 35 non accredited investors. And so, the only the only thing about the 506 B is that you can't have you can't publicly advertise that deal. And so it has to be people that you have personal relationships with. And, you know, the SEC goes into all of like, how many touches you have, and stuff that goes beyond this call. But the point being is that, you know, if you're, if you if you want to raise money from non accredited investors, five or six, B, you have to have relationships with them already, like your friends family. You can talk to them about that deal. And there's no minimum, 20:58 you, grandma can borrow $1,000,000.02 million dollars. 21:02 Yeah. Of course, you have the deal. We have the money. 21:08 Hang on me. Ha write your check right now. 21:12 So yeah, so So in a 506 B, you know, there's no minimum like they you, you can do as low as you want. But you don't want it too low, because then you would need a lot more people that you need to raise money from right. So let's say you're trying to raise a million dollars, if each person invests 100,000, that's only 10 people you have to deal with, if each person invest 10,000, that's 100 people you have to deal with, right? So 21:41 the deal, everybody that puts in money, are they like silent partners, or are they? 21:45 Yeah, yeah. So they are solid partners. They're called Limited Partners, which is completely silent. They don't have voting rights or anything like that. And so yeah, so that's, so that's a 506. B, a 506. C. That's for accredited investors only. So what that means is basically, they have roughly about a million dollars net worth. And you can advertise that type of investment publicly, you don't have to have prior relationship with them. So if you see any ads on Facebook, that you know that that's raising money, typically, that's a 506. C and raising money from accredited investors. 22:28 Powerful information, 22:29 appreciate the clarification, too, because I just said, there's like I said, I know a little bit, but not a lot. And I even helped me a little bit. So I appreciate that. 22:37 Yeah, you're welcome. 22:40 So if anybody wants to partner with you, they just send you like, send you a deal directly. Yeah, somewhere they can send it to and say, Hey, I have some land. I think you should take a look at this. 22:48 Yeah, yeah. I mean, they can certainly hit me up directly. I'm pretty active on Messenger, especially active on Facebook. And so yeah, so certainly send it and then the way it works is that if it's a normal kind of deal that my team are used to, I'll pass it over to my team, they'll handle all of that. But if it's a more, you know, if it's a bigger deal more complicated deal, then I'll you know, I'll personally dig deeper into those type of deals. 23:18 Okay, awesome, man. Yeah, I'm really excited about the fundraising aspect of putting some of these bigger deals together, because like, it kind of goes beyond where seller financing isn't going to work anymore. And available capital on hand, even if you liquidated, everything you had isn't going to work anymore. So yeah, you need to get some other people involved in some of these. 23:36 Yeah, yeah, for sure. Especially if you're going to get into like bigger subdivides vibe, you're going to buy, you know, 100 acres or a few 100 acres, and you're going to subdivide those bigger deals. Generally speaking, I think that, I mean, there's no like, technically, there's no size limit, but it's rare that that I see someone that does a syndication for a deal that less than five, less than $5 million, is because you know, like I said, the document costs you 15 grand to create. So it's just fun to document and so there's there's costs involved in doing syndications. And so typically, people do it on bigger deals. And then if it's smaller deals, they'll either use private money or they'll they'll do joint ventures, so they'll bring on a money partner, maybe 123 partners that come on pull money together. So that's more common on smaller deals. But yeah, when you when you're ready to do the much bigger deals, syndication, it's a it's a very common way of doing it. And you know, it's it's been it's the law get easier since about 10 years ago. And so that's why now you see, it's such a common place that of people doing syndications now. 24:58 Yeah, I got a bunch of deals in my mind. Brains cycling through right now. Like, we need to look at this one, you'd look at this one. It just opens up so many more doors. 25:06 It does. It does for sure. Yeah. So now it's like, now I'm not afraid of, you know, I'm not afraid of looking at bigger deals. I know you guys know, but I've been interviewing a lot of guys on my own show a lot of guys I've interviewed, they've raised over 100 million. What that means is typically they've done over $500 million in business. And, and yeah, the deal size that they're talking about, it's like, it's huge. It blows my mind away. And, and it's, they talk about like, it's nothing like it's just another zero, and you raise more money for more people. And that's it. That's all. 25:46 What are you learning? Like, what's the main? What are the main takeaways you're learning from interviewing people like that? Because I seen you interviewing some whales on there. 25:52 Yeah, you know, I would say the biggest takeaway is just, it's really, it's just another number. Like, it's just another zero, like we, you know, yeah, like we tend, and me personally shoot, I've been in real estate for 20 years now, most of which has been in single family home space. And the reason is, because for the longest time, I just said to myself, like, Oh, these apartment deals, these bigger deal, commercial deals, they're too difficult, they're too big, you know, I'm comfortable with these low houses that I know what to do, I can do it with my eyes closed. And so and so so, so, like, I have this, this, you know, limiting belief that I can't do these big deals, they're, they're more complicated. Well, the truth is, now that I'm in it, it's, you know, it's so far from the truth of the way I used to look at it, with these big deals, it's almost never, that you find one person doing this whole big deal all by themselves, it just doesn't exist. So so so it's a very in the in this, you know, bigger deal space, it's a very teamwork, you know, so you have, you generally have several people that come together. And they might be business partners in a specific business, or it could be like, you have your own business, I have my own business. But you know, we found a deal. And we come in and do the deals together. And then let's say, you handle all the acquisition, I'm gonna handle all the capital raising, you know, and then Daniel's gonna handle all the developments, you know, like, so it's a very teamwork type of environment. And that's the reason why it's not a big, big thing to do these big deals is because you're not by yourself, you're not trying to do it on your own, you have a whole team that's going to come together and some of these deals where, let's say, you know, I see a syndicator need to raise $100 million on just one deal. Using that as an example. What happens is that the the person who, who might might be in charge of that deal, they're not the only person raising money for that deal, there might be 10, or even 20. Entities behind that, that's all coming together to raise money for this big, you know, big deal. And so, so it's all it's all about teamwork. It's not about like individual work. Even if you know, even if all you can raise is a million bucks, let's use that as an example. Let's say it's like, okay, you know, if you can exhaust all of your whole network, you can raise a million bucks. But because you can raise a million dollars, you can be in with one of the, you know, 2050, guys, that's going to raise that whole 100 million dollars. So yeah, so it's, you know, the business is very built on teamwork, which makes everything so much easier, you don't have to be an expert of anything. Very different from the single family home space, when you kind of have to be an expert of everything. Because the deal is so small, there's not enough profit to go around for you to have that many partnerships and for you to have super smart partners. But in these bigger deals, you know, there's a lot more money to go around. And so you attract the top players that comes in and partner together to take these deals down. 29:21 What's crazy about that is a lot of people like they want to keep their business small and wear every hat and like I can do it the best out of anywhere, anybody I want. And the crazy part about it is the bigger you get, the easier it becomes because you can always outsource and find the right people to help you do the need to do. Yeah, so that's the term of scalability, the larger you get. So everybody out there thinking small union think bigger. 29:43 Yep, yep, yep. Yeah. 29:45 And I think you're the one that helped push that button in my brain. Tim, is I called you one day and I'll tell it to talk to you about some of the deals I was doing and we're just kind of sharing back and forth again, working on wondering now that 60 million and I was like, then why am I working on these little? It's cool to think that Probably something that I've enjoyed the most even more than like the dollars and cents about these deals is the people that you meet the connection, you said the quality of people and like the ideas that they have just personality types, like people are very laid back very calm, right? Because there's a, I guess everything's are had the potential to go very well. If you can stay level headed, stay helpful, stay humble. And that's what I'm realizing is that sitting at these tables, hopping on these phone calls, hopping on these zooms, these people are the people that you'd want to be around anyway. Super helpful, super humble, super connected. And I think that's cool, man. That's something that I've enjoyed more than anything else is the relationships that we're making. 30:40 Yeah, yeah, me too, for sure. And I That's, yeah, for some reason, the this industry, and for the lack of better term, I'm calling it you know, the big deal with industry. Yeah, that can include laying nickel includes apartment commercial real estate, but I found that most people in this industry are very collaborative, tight. You know, like, that's just the way they've been in business. I think it's, the industry cannot force them to think that way. And, and so yeah, it's, it's been phenomenal. I love the people that, that, you know, that that I've been interact with, and meeting with, like, like you've mentioned, and yeah, the people I've been interviewing, I mean, gosh, they blow my mind away all the time. Yeah. 31:30 So can you talk about the capital raising Summit? What is that? And who do you know, who's your general people that wants to come? 31:36 Yeah, so So basically, it's, it's about how to raise capital for big deals. A lot of people who are coming as syndicators. They're raising money for apartments, you know, commercial real estate, land development. We also have some fun managers that are coming as well. One of the one of the family office. And that's a whole new different level of individuals family office, the gentleman I'm talking to later on today, he's coming his company, his family office. So family office is basically when you are an ultra wealthy family. You You You pull money together as a family, and then you hire a, a, like a financial advisor to help your family invest that money. Okay. So you see that a lot with you know, like, like the Rockefeller family, they probably have the biggest family office. You know, and so anyways, the gentleman that one gentleman that's coming in, he runs a family office, they they've done over $15 billion worth of real estate. Crazy. Yeah. It's crazy numbers like that. And, and yeah, so he's coming. And you know, and so, yeah, so it's a lot of people that are there are in the commercial real estate space, people that need to raise a lot of money. And, and so yeah, so if you guys, you know, want to learn how to raise a lot of money come, it is a more, it is a more advanced crowd. So you're looking like how to get started in real estate. You know, a lot of that's gonna go over your head, because it's, it's a more complicated topic. But But yeah, if you're already in real estate, and you want to learn how to raise money, is definitely a room to be in. 33:36 Awesome, awesome. That's one of that's one thing. There's always there's always different types of and that's why I really wanted to ask, like with your question, because if you're new, don't go there. You're gonna miss it. Yes. But it's more for advanced people that are already wanting to get in that space are already in that space that you can network and meet other people. 33:53 Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, the network's gonna be crazy. Yeah, the caliber in the room is just insane. Insane. No, I don't have any. 34:05 Now go ahead. Good. 34:06 I was just saying, what is the quote that is yours or somebody else's that you resonate with? 34:14 i Okay, I just heard this quote this morning. Actually, I was listening to Marianne Williamson, who she's a teacher of A Course in Miracles. And she said, this worry, is praying for bad things to happen. And, you know, because as entrepreneurs, I don't know about you guys, but I get anxiety all the time. Yeah. So I'm, like constantly having to meditate and listen to these to help me but but when I heard that, it's like that. I mean, it makes so much sense, right? Because what is a worry of worry? Is is, you know, us thinking about something that hasn't happened yet. that's out there in the future, and we're thinking negatively about it. So Oh, it's like it is, you know, it is like, you know, dreaming about something bad's gonna happen. And so, so yeah, that was a really good quote. non-living has to do with business. But if you if you if you're like me, if you're a worrier, you get anxiety. Keep that in mind. 35:15 I'll tell you what, man, if you're not growing and stretching and pushing yourself, then then you have no stress, you have no worry. But if you're always pushing yourself outside of your comfort zone, you're gonna have it. I'll tell you something that helped me a lot was getting rid of caffeine. Because I was just going through cups and cups of coffee, not thinking about it feeling great energy, but I was like, Why the hell am I worried? Like, so often? Like, what is it? And so once I eliminated the caffeine completely, I feel like at least 50% 75% of it went away. And then I added to CrossFit, and that's helping too. So 35:45 that's awesome. Yeah, I agree with you. I mean, you know, coffee does different things for different people. But yeah, it does give me anxiety attacks. 35:55 Drink, like a million bucks. And then some days I drink and I just start talking about, I start highlighting all the little negative things that are going on. And like, Why did I do what I should have did this and like, why am I thinking? Doesn't cares? Yeah, identify the problem and get rid of it. So I love that quote, and I do I need to reread A Course in Miracles. It's probably been 15 years since I picked that book up. 36:18 Yeah, good. Good stuff. Yeah. 36:21 Can you recommend a business book that you recommend the business book in general, that you like, 36:28 a business book that I like? I mean, you know, when depends, you know, on if you're looking for mindset stuff, or more tactical stuff, but I love I love book that has around to do with mindset. I know, you know, Rich Dad, Poor Dad made a big difference. For me, it shifted my mind. A lot when when I first started as an entrepreneur. I like books, like, like, you know, mini habits, atomic habits, you know, talking about like, little habits that you do. I like books that are Miracle Morning is really good, too. I go through different phases in my journey where, okay, I'll take, you know, I'll take one discipline, one practice, I'll go all in with that practice. You know, whether that's meditation, or that's journaling, or so I'll do, you know, um, I don't know, and probably has to do with my personality type too. I, I, I find myself, you know, I'll do something for a few months, and then I'll go and try something new for another few months. And now, I'll do it in stages like that. Versus I know, some people, they have the same routine that they do every single day, right? Like, they're gonna, you know, meditate journal read, like, every single day, they do it that way. My personality just doesn't work that way. And so I have to change it around. I went through a period of time where I even shaved my head, I'm like, do something different. So yeah. But yeah, I mean, you know, Anthony, you talk to me, you're talking about like, CrossFit, stuff like that, gosh, like MIT mental health is a real thing. Mental illness is a real thing, right. And so, as entrepreneurs, we, because the, you know, because of how much we have to do, and the amount of like, even here at my office, right, I have so many staff I have to take care of and their families and in the Philippines, I have tons of Bas, tons of family have to take care of. And so, so So, so yeah, like we deal with a different level of stress than normal people do it. And so we do have to stay on top of all the mental health that we could possibly equip ourselves with, right? Whether that's, you know, meditation, or this mindset books, or CrossFit exercise, you know, those are all good. So I mean, they're not exactly business, but they do more good for your business, and any, any tactical stuff you can do in your business. Yeah, dude, 39:06 that's amazing. Then I said that recently, I said, you know, I'm a better business person when I'm going to CrossFit because I went several years ago for several years in a row. And I remember like, how like invincible I felt, and everything always went my way. Everything was easy meeting sales, super, super easy. And then I started to injure the shoulder. I didn't hurt it, but I like I need to lay off of it. So I stopped going through a few years. And I was wondering, like, things are going amazing. But like, I feel like I'm better at business than this, like what's going on here. And now I've been back for like five months. And Mandy and I feel amazing. I feel like I'm knocking down walls again. And it's like it directly correlates with me like pushing myself and it's like, I think it's all the extra oxygen in your body, sweating out all those toxins. But then also like you have time to think putting myself first and I'm at the gym every day at nine. First things first. Nope, I've had no meetings before noon at all zero, like family and gym first and then after that, then we'll go ahead and start knocking out the rest of the stuff for the day and then I'm good to work till midnight, but Yeah, you're right, man. If you don't take care of your mental health, this business will it'll kick your butt. Yep, sure, well, yeah, I see my kids and they're happy and they're smiling. They're loving life, the wife everything. And then I'm just thinking, like, I wonder if everything about how hard I have 40:17 nobody knows our pain, but us. Like that guy. 40:21 This one is carrying the globe, caring. For them, everything's super cool, and super easy and fun. And I'm over here, like, when a CrossFit just so my head doesn't explode. I was gonna say that to about a about meditation. You know, I wake up in the morning, and First things first, just pray and just go by myself and get away from everything. no music, no lights, no cell phone. And I tried to do it every day. But it's probably three days a week, right? But it helps tremendously. Yeah, it helps me calm the storm and put things into perspective. But I think between those two tools have probably been the most powerful tools that I found in business. And it's not even business related. 40:55 Yeah. Yeah, that's good. And one of the things you mentioned, because I know some of us, we deal with, like, wanting to consume a lot of information, right, read a lot of books. I went through periods where I went, I went through an entire year without consuming any new content. So like, I wouldn't read books, I wouldn't watch YouTube videos, I would only self generate content. So you know, yeah. And so it's you. I mean, it was pretty tough to go through mentally. But, I mean, you're like, you're so much more creative than you give yourself to all of us, all of us. I mean, the truth is, that if we just run our business based on our true intuition will do just fine. Without any outside information like us, for some reason, intuitively, we know what to do. We know what our business needs. But a lot of times, we don't trust ourselves enough. And so we're trying to learn strategies and tactics from other people. But yeah, you know, if you're the type of person who consume a lot of content, it might be a good exercise for you to do the opposite, which is not consuming the content, and only self generate content, you know, and almost like coaching yourself through it. So yeah, so during that time, I went on a lot of walks, where I just turn on my phone recorder and just talk, like, I'm just talking to myself. That was that was really good. Good exercise. 42:23 Dude. Another another powerful tip. Dude, that's so freakin amazing. I forgot about that. So I would do it for like, I've never done a year but I've done weeks and months at a time. Where no music, no YouTube, no nothing, no books, nothing at all. Yeah, just just me and myself. And yeah, you're right. I mean, some of your best inspirations come during those periods of information detox, because you're exactly. You're trying to learn new things over and over and over again, and you get overload. And it's like, even the new information is not even helpful anymore. Right. But I think for people that are entrepreneurial, that you're trying to push yourself to grow, push your business to grow, that's something that you're gonna do, you're gonna you're gonna end up with information overload. So you need to do an information detox, that's powerful. Yeah. 43:00 Yeah. Yeah. Like, you know, I only on at the beginning of the show, I share my, my, my, what, you know, how I got started with Lee and right, like, I got on the call, I heard John share about one tip, just one tip, this is the list. And I got off the call, like, there was no more information, just implementation. Like, that's a very important skill set. You wanna, you know, especially if you're out there in the US, you know, you're having challenges doing your first deal, or just having challenges doing deals at all. Yeah, and, you know, stopping the information and focus on implementation is super, super important. 43:40 Beautiful, man, dude, I think we'll go ahead and wrap it up right here. This was an amazing show. Tons and tons of knowledge and jams. I'm gonna have to listen to this one a few times. If you came in late, guys, as soon as this is over, go back to the beginning and press play. This was this was amazing. Yeah, I bet this one's gonna get a ton of use. Lots of information, lots of power in this conversation. 44:00 We appreciate your time, Tim and I like I said, I look forward to everything that you do and like helping us out in the future. And let's see, let's see what damage we can do with the deals we have coming up. 44:10 Awesome. Yeah. Looking forward to 44:12 it. Jenna should be in Houston next week, I think. So man would love to sit down, grab some lunch and talk a little bit. Get some deals in front of you that we're working on and looking at right now. See if we can spark some new ideas. 44:23 Let's do it. Awesome, man. Thank 44:25 you. This was super fun. Super Amazing. We appreciate you for coming on. 44:28 All right, awesome. Thanks. Thanks for having me on. Thanks, everyone. Sees

Daniel Esteban MartinezProfile Photo

Daniel Esteban Martinez

Host/ Ceo/ Speaker

I have been an entrepreneur since 2018. I come from a regular home just like most people. My dad worked on the roads in the Chicago area for over 30 years. He always taught me to work with my brain, instead of my body. Your body can only take so much abuse. I learned so much from my father. He always pushed me to work smarter and not harder.

I have owned and operated a trucking business for 2 years. I started learning real estate in 2019. Fell into the Data & Skiptracing business in 2020. My partner Anthony & I started Hivemind in 2021.

I have done a ton of different jobs coming up from painting, to door-to-door sales, telemarketing, truck driving, and loading trailers. What I learned most is that I want to stay in the digital business space. The leverage you can have delivering digital products to the marketplace can yield limitless possibilites.

I started The List Guys in 2020. It is a data and skiptracing service. We provide seller and buyers list nationwide. My clients have been getting great results and I am proud to help people killing it.

I started the Hive in 2021 with my partner Anthony Gaona. It is a real estate and business mastermind. It also comes with a all in one CRM, that can host unlimited websites and users.

Starting the Hivemind has been an amazing journey so far. Seeing one of our users make his 6 figure month in June 2021 leveraging our software, I know there will be plenty more to come!

Anthony GaonaProfile Photo

Anthony Gaona

Host/ Ceo/ Speaker

Hi! I am Anthony Gaona.
I’ve been in digital marketing for almost 15 years.I grew up in construction working for my dad when I was only 12 years old. Normally we had a ton of work or no work at all so a lot of my free time was spent learning how to generate leads.

It didn’t take very long for me to master online marketing because I became absolutely obsessed with it. For the last 15 years I’ve been generating construction based leads. At first I was running the projects myself. This led to sub-contracting all of the excess projects and eventually wholesaling the leads off to other construction companies.

One day I was preparing to build a single family residence for myself. In mid December, 2018, a simple YouTube search led me to the term wholesaling and the rest is history. The plan was to use my construction background to start flipping houses. By January 1st of 2019 I launched several marketing campaigns both on and offline for real estate seller leads.

Within about 4-5 weeks I had my first real estate contract locked up. It didn’t take long for me get a land lead where I made almost a full year’s pay on a single transaction. This came from a land lead and that forever changed my life.

I ran low volume larger land deals for the first two years of my real estate career. Like anyone who has been in real estate investing for an extended period of time, I started thinking about scaling my business.

Instead of deciding to vertically integrated and start hiring I imagined a model where I would teach my real estate investing methods to others. This would free up my personal bandwidth and allow for unlimited large scale transactions.

Currently our operations are expanding globally. The goal is to identify one person per major US Market that we can build a team around and drive traffic to so we can close high volume transactions together.

You can learn more about our vision and join our free mastermind by joining hivemind CRM on Facebook and all social channels

Tim MaiProfile Photo

Tim Mai


Tim Mai is the embodiment of the American Dream. Having survived a childhood that included war, a dramatic escape from pirates at sea, and languishing in a refugee camp, he arrived to
Houston, Texas, at age 12, with his 19 year-old brother, speaking no English and with nothing
more than the shirt on their back.
Tim seized the opportunities America presented him with by hustling his way through high school, college, and eventually realizing his dream of financial independence through real estate.
Tim has taught thousands of entrepreneurs all over the world how to get started in real estate investing and has charged upward of $100,000 a year for coaching.
Along with his many business accomplishments, he has also been very active with several
charity organizations in Houston and has helped raise hundreds of thousands of dollars for charities.
Tim lives in Houston, TX with his, high school sweetheart, wife and two amazing teenage boys.