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Nov. 5, 2022

Ep 258: Land and Lot Investing and Hivemind Software: RealLifeRealEstateInvesting Show

Ep 258: Land and Lot Investing and Hivemind Software: RealLifeRealEstateInvesting Show


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0:27 All right. All right. Good afternoon, folks. It is the middle of the day again on a Wednesday when we're back here with Wednesdays less time learning with real life real estate investing, where we talk about real life real estate situations, but we bring you real life Real Estate Solutions. I'm your host, Glenn glassware, affectionately known as Mr. Dahle, out of a dime. And of course, I have another special guest that's going to be sharing with us some phenomenal information. As you know, I like to always bring on people that can add value, and help us understand some of the things that are most proficient in what we do in real estate investing. All right, again, thank you all for joining us today, I have a special guest, Mr. Daniel Martinez, who's going to be sharing with us some amazing information. For those of you that have been doing real estate are looking to get into doing real estate, you know how important it is to be organized, and have a system and things like that. Mr. Daniel Martinez is going to talk to us about CRMs and how to use them and how beneficial they are to what we do. And he's also going to he's also going to give us a special bonus and talk about land investing, which I know a lot of people are getting into now. So without further ado, we're gonna bring up Mr. Martinez. How're you doing today, sir? 1:40 I'm doing amazing, dude. Amazing. Happy to be here. 1:43 Very good. Very good. Thank you so much for coming on the show. And you know, we did we of course we do our research and things like that. We know that you've done some amazing things. But I want to give you an opportunity to share with the folks who you are, and then we'll dive right into what we're going to be talking about today. 2:00 Sure, sure. So my name is Ian Martinez. I am the I host the podcast, I do real estate, I do land I do software to data company. I'm all over like the real estate side of things. But I wasn't always this I used to be a truck driver blue collar used to drive 18 wheelers down the road, and external my first trucking company and then pivoted into real estate after that. And I've been down sure for five years and just kind of started the CRM it was a lot of people ask like, you have to have like a personal why we also need a business why why do you like doing what you do? And I really know what that was till I started hide mine. Long story short, we've now had a 14 clients, six figure months. So it's like, if I can hit one I can attend, I can hit 1000. So we're trying to help more people hit six figure months in the business and accelerate their business to the next level. 2:47 Great stuff, great stuff. Now, of course, I know there's somebody that's going to Washington to say help clients hit six figure months. How, how does that happen? It relates to the CRM, how do you help people do that? 3:00 It's one, it's one of those things where like this, it's really to the CRM, and that's what it is. A CRM is a customer relations management tool, it helps you accelerate your business. So I have clients that were doing spreadsheets and paper before their that was their CRM, write down keeping track followup with this person 30 days from now. And then they forget not do it. And it's one of those things where like, you lose a lot of efficiency when you're not systematized. So clients that are they understand that they need a CRM, they'll come in and like, Okay, I know, I need this tool, let me learn how to use it. Let me let me amplify my work hours. So my whole thing is automation before delegation, because if you if you automate first, you might not have to delegate it at all. So I have people come in, like, oh, I have a VA doing this, this and this and like, well, they don't have to do that anymore. Because you can automate that 100%. And that's just gonna work. So it's one of those things where like, if you if you automate verse, you can really amplify your time, your BAS time. And you can take your business to the next level by doing by being more efficient, doing my marketing, doing follow ups, even the keyword responses, so you can actually reply to messages effectively, without having to do it yourself. 4:06 Wow, wow, that's amazing. Now, this automation before delegation, now, most of most of us know that, you know, get into the business of real estate, one of the biggest thing is having a team, you can be more efficient and when you have a team, because of course, you know, it's hard to do most of what we do by yourself. And the delegation part is what many of us strive to do is have a team to delegate those things. Two, how is automation? How do we incorporate automation before delegation? How does that work? 4:38 As well as these were like, I would have you can assign a VA to follow up with everybody. That's a full time job and most real estate business that's a full time job with our system that you can literally set up follow up with every person that's replied positively every 30 to 45 days. Boom done, and it just works. So it's one of those things where like, that's that's a full time position or you'd have some We follow up with everybody every 30 to 45 days, if they were somewhat interested, it's just done that's out out the window. So like, there's simple tasks like that, that you don't think about that is really taking them a lot of your VAs hours to clean up your hours. And it's just taking up on the unneeded space in your business that can make you more efficient and effective. 5:19 Great stuff, great stuff. And in hive mind, right, that's the CRM we're talking about, right? So there is a there is a apparatus, I imagine that allows a person that needs to be followed up with in a certain amount of time, and allows them for them to get, maybe it was an automated message, or automated email or text message or something like that, that communicates to the people that they're trying to follow up with all the 5:44 above. So one of the cool things about our system is that most systems out there are most most things out there, software's only do one thing, they might just do call and call forwarding, they might just do texting, they might just do websites, they might just do forums, they might just do email marketing. So like, it's really hard to combine and communicate, because they don't communicate with each other. So you kind of weren't texting, you kind of work, you listen to the dialer, to kind of work your list through the email platform, if you if you're even doing that all, like doing all those things. So if you can, if the system can communicate, you can set up like a specific campaign that actually works and talks to each other. So this is a max Maxwell's thing you can look it up, I don't know if you've heard of it, it's called the lead conveyor belt experiments is to put your your your list through the cheapest form of marketing first to the most expensive. So emailing, texting, RVM can all be automated and put out in a campaign. But you can actually build out a campaign that does all those in one campaign, versus just using email system just as a test just in the RPM system. Now you can do it, email, text, text, RVM. And then if they don't respond to any of those, I can put it on my team to do a cold call. Because now it's actually taking human man hours. So you can build up that campaign run 1000s people through the list, and it's just gonna go 7:03 wow, wow. Now that is some serious automation, serious automation. So if you said they don't respond to any of those initial campaigns, do the email and text, then it gives your team and notification to call them? Yeah. Wow, okay, okay. And there's, there's a 7:23 dialer inside of it. So you can literally put it straight into the thing when it hits this point, assign it to John Smith, who's my who's my cold caller, and he just goes, checks his checks his task, and he checks his cold call, who needs a call that day? And then you just hit start and start down? 7:38 Wow, wow, that is that is certainly something that, you know, would help people to get to that six figure mark on a monthly basis, because they're not having to do a lot of the, you know, for lack of a little bit, lack of a better way of saying it the heavy lifting. You know, especially with having VAs and, you know, with I mean, like you mentioned all of the delegation that has to go into that, the automation will certainly make it a whole lot easier. 8:01 And like each, each one of those phases, when you pass it on as opportunity for it to get lost, like you might totally forget about that person. And this is one way that you're going to get everybody, you're going to hit everybody in every single way. And then you're not going to you're not going to have any flex or loss from or efficiencies from your whole campaign. 8:22 Now in that, so for example, let's let's you know, let's put it in this situation. If someone replies to a text message that says, I'm not interested, what would be the next automated thing that happens? I mean, would there be a message that goes to the cold caller or goes to or they just drop off the system? And how does that work? 8:43 It depends. You can literally create I'm not interested option where if they say not interested specifically, you can kick it off to 8:50 cold call or to call. Okay, okay. Okay. So, 8:55 yeah, that's one of the things were like, if they responded, anyways, it can came off the campaign, because if you text them like, hey, is this John Smith? And they replied, yeah, I'm looking to, yeah, this is John says, How can I help you? And then you hit them with we're looking to buy, we're looking to buy property in the area, or that you might hit him with? I don't know, if we got a hold of you last time type of question. You don't want to do that. So if you have like a specific outreach campaign, whenever they respond, then it kicks it to another bucket. And then you're Toxie having a conversation over here, which is maybe if they respond, not interested if they cuss you out, if they say yes, in any way with keyword Yes. Boom, in case it's so straight to your acquisitions team to actually Hey, we have a hot lead that said yes, at this point in the stage. 9:36 You mentioned there's an automated part for it because you're out as well. 9:39 You can set up automation numbers if it's wrong because of automation to swap a number out because you have multiple numbers and you have skip trace list out a number and spit in the campaign again, and all this can be automated. 9:54 Great stuff. Great stuff. We have a question Miss Miss Cassie piano says, can it work with funnel systems? 10:04 So we actually have internal funnel systems. So if you guys are using Clickfunnels in any way, you can actually copy your Click Funnels website onto our platform for free as long as your funnel. 10:15 Okay, okay, 10:16 we have sites too. So we use, we use our websites for PPC. So it's just a website with a form on it. And the reason we do that is because we want to, we don't want, we don't want people to click down the about us the contact us page. If we're doing PPC marketing to a, for a lead page, we want them only to have ability to lead page and that's it. So they're gonna, we're gonna get more people filling out the form versus clicking around and about us and contact us and picture and we're family and with now, suddenly the form that's it. 10:50 Great, right? You don't want to click it all over the place. Okay, great stuff, great stuff. Cassiano says, Oh, wow, this stuff. And you know, this something like this, it would definitely come in handy for a lot of, you know, new inexperienced investors because of the ability to automate that process. And I imagine, you know, you've had some success and doing it with your business. So tell me, what is the typical, I guess, automated situation. So you mentioned email. So as an email first, then text. So imagine your leads are coming in through some type of funnel system or the PPC, as you mentioned? So is there a funnel system that it goes through first, that takes it down that road of you know, the communication, automated communication? 11:38 I mean, it depends on the type of marketing you're doing. So like, let's say you, let's say you do direct mail, we have a lot of us direct now, what do you put on your direct mail, you put a website, and you put a phone, you can set up phone number tracking, and you can put a website where people can come in, when it goes directly to your website, boom comes in. If you're doing bandit signs, what do you put on a bandit sign you put a phone number on it, call tracking, call forwarding, if somebody calls or texted in, you can make a stupid number for that bandit sign in that specific area. Hey, I know you hit the sign in this area. How? What property type property do you have in Harris County or whatever, whatever that city that is you can specifically target them because you know what, what campaign they're a part of. So you can really build out a lot of customization based off of what number they're texting. What, what in from what channel they came in through from, if they hit you from the email channel, okay, well, we're how to build the email campaign. That was what this was. So it's a tagging system. So we use we use this for dispositions, we use this for acquisitions, we use this for a lot of different things. It's just one of those things where like, it kind of works the way you want it to. And we just work it. 12:42 Oh, good, good, good, good. And I imagine, you know, somebody will probably want to know, how do I set this up? If I don't have any technical skills? Is it something that you set up for me? Or do I have to go through and learn how to do this all myself to be able to make it work the way I need it to work? 12:57 So we have two different types of clients. So we have clients that are like, I need to learn how to use this tool, because I want to be most effective when using it. And then I have other clients like, I just want to use it. And this is one way can you set it up for me. So whenever you get an account created, we already have like the basic setup for you, we ask that you go to the trainings that way you kind of understand how it works. But like if you're that person, like I want to pay, you don't know anything about technology, can you do this, this and this will do it for you. It's not, it's not a question of like, how to do it. It's like, Hey, if you have as long as you have like SOP process in your mind, hey, normally when I text, I send out this message. And then if they respond this, I'd like to do this, this and this, just kind of having a wireframe of what you want done and what my team will not cut out for you. And you have the ability to do it yourself, of course. But it's one of the things it's like, there's time and money, you have the time you got the money, time to do it yourself or the money to pay somebody else to do it. 13:47 Great. Great, great, great idea. Great idea. It's great that you mention that, you know, that's one of the things that I've mentioned quite a bit. You know, when I talk to people, you know, most people have the idea that you can do real estate with no money and no credit. But you got to have a lot of time. 14:06 It took me seven months to get my first deal. So like, I when I was going through the pain, I was like, Man, this is terrible. I contracted multiple properties, but they all felt that for different reasons. But like when I finally got my first deal, I'm like, Man, this is gonna be a good story. 14:19 Right? Right. So so let's talk about that for a little bit. So you said you it took you seven months to get your first deal. So when I first I started studying, I studied for two years before I actually attempted to do my first deal. So you were better than me the first time my first ever row. That's because there were you know, I didn't have a mentor or anything like that. I bought the Carlton sheets course and I read it for like two years before I even you know, took a stab at it the first time. Do you mind sharing with us? What was your process and what was what was the kind of what were some of the lessons that you learned during that seven month period? 14:56 It was I took a course so for everybody wants to get in this game, buy some type, of course minimal course go out to YouTube go get educated on the front end before you start putting your foot in your mouth, because it can happen really quick. So get educated a little bit before you jump in. So I took a course I paid like 10 or 15 bucks for it at the time, and I kind of got the education. But for me it was it was a necessity I was I was already an entrepreneur at that point doing trucking. And I was doing I had a bit I had to pivot because my trucking company was going through the wringer wasn't really making any money. So I was trying I had to pivot so it was like a necessity for me are you had like the option of like, now let me keep on studying and do this me it was like I have to do something else. Like it was like a wall. So like for me, like I contracted a bunch of houses, I probably contracted five properties, all houses before I did my first deal. My first deal that actually contracted in close was land deal, and never looked back ever since. So I've been doing strictly lead after that. The only I've only ever done one other house seal. And that was because I moved from Atlanta. And I did a lease purchase with my own house that I bought with my own mortgage. So that's the only other house do I've ever done. And other SS land. 16:14 Oh, wow. So you primarily just do land? 100% land? Wow, wow. What are we missing out on? Why are we what are we missing out on doing land instead of doing houses? 16:25 So land is there's think about this, everybody think, oh, there's opportunity houses. Think of how much the United States is land, like 60% of the United States is land. So think about how much opportunity that is. There's less competition because people don't know what it is. Not with another result, we're like it doesn't cashflow. So we're as a house, a seller knows they can list it, they can sell it they can put on Airbnb, they can rent it out, they can leave it vacant if they want. So they have all these options with land either seller hold, and that's the only options they have. That's it, and taxes are owed every year. So they're actually negative cash flowing every year. So those were the underlying motivation. Whereas like most people that do houses, they're targeting water shut off list and vacant list and tired landlord list, we just target land, because they're all motivated. And they're all motivated in some way. So check us out, and there's no attachment to it too. So most land is owned, most land is owned free and clear. So you can get a really good deal. So think about if you ever done a free and clear property, but a really, really you can really sometimes get a really good deal on that because they're they're thinking from 20 years ago what the equity was and how much equity it is now, they might not know what they're talking about. So with land, you can really get a good deal really gonna get a deal. And we can talk about some case studies and stuff like that. But you can really get a good deal. And there's no attachment to it. So like most time it's passed down. Grandma had it passed down to the kids. And now there's it's just passed on passed on, they probably never seen it never visited it, there's no attachment to it, they just something they inherited that they have to pay a bill for every year. Number two is that there's no like verifiable comps. So like, whereas there's a three two neighborhood that has three twos with 2500 square feet, there's gonna be houses that sold all throughout the neighborhood. Because there's a verifiable comps with land, there's not. So it's all subject to what a seller is willing to pay for it, or what a buyer is willing to pay for it. And that's 100% leverage. So like we'll get into land, we'll get land deals. And we'll oversell the property, because it's all will owner finance it. So we create the financing, we create the terms and we'll create the price. So we can create a huge spread. Whereas if your house is you have to sell to an investor. So you're losing twice, you have to create profit for the end investor, and you have to create profit for yourself. Whereas if you do land, you can still say freight to retail and click all the profit, which is why we do bigger spreads. So like all of our deals, we usually average like 50,000 Plus, on all of our deals just because we are sending directly to the retail side. And we have no buyers like what's your buyers list? Like? 19:01 We have a buyers so how does one so what's the benefit? Like so, you know, you said you don't have a buyer's list, you know, there's no comps. So for a person to look at that and be attracted to that. Of course the you know, the huge spread. I mean, you name the several benefits. But for me, okay, say I'm a novice and I have no idea what any of that means. What is the thing that attracts me to land over houses? What's the single most important thing that would attract me to it? 19:34 Do you have any rentals right now? Yes. What's the average rental income you get from a rental? 19:41 About 500 $600.05 600 bucks? 19:44 Yeah, pretty much right. Check us out. You did a deal. That was about a $35,000 lot about a year ago. Seller came in. Hey, I want $15,000 For my property. Okay, we'll give you will give you eight here. He's like, No, I need 15 I have to get 14. Like, alright, so 90 days passes by, he comes back. Hey, you're still interested my property like yeah, of course, which is like I got this property on 15 for like a I remember you, we told you eight. He's like you can't do any better. Not all eight. He's like, Alright, so we contracted her for eight chickens out with land, you can contract for 90 days. That's not unheard of longer stretch periods. So 90 days, what do we do? We put it on Facebook marketplace for $8,000. Down 500 a month for five years. We found a buyer in a week, we sold it for 40,000 $8,000. Down went straight to the seller. And we clicked the 500 a month for five years on a deal we put no money into. Wow, how many $35,000? Lots out are out there. 20:51 True. True. Great. All right. 20:54 Once we learn the power of owner financing, and creating spreads, now we're just doing this with larger properties. We're trying to buy 50 acres or more owner finance it out and make 510 to 10,000 a month on single transactions. 21:09 True, true. True. Okay. Okay, I see where you go. And I see where you go. And so how does how do you you know, you mentioned that there is no verifiable cops. So how do I know what the land is worth? I mean, I got an acre of land. It's in? I don't know, near I will say near major metropolitan city. How do I evaluate that if there's only two or three lights available? 21:34 So the the truth of the answer is, there's gonna be a lot more than that. There's a lot of I mean, think about this on the commute to have your favorite restaurant, how many vacant lots Do you see a lot through, there's a lot more vacant land than you realize it because you're not really paying attention for it. But when you actually want like everybody wants to hear this conversation, you're like you're gonna see every vacant lot to the grocery store, you're like, just because you heard this conversation today about this, so you're gonna realize how much of really vacant land there is out there. And vacant land is subjective. Check this out for Oh, in the city. There's what you call infill lots where it might be a business, business vacant lot, a restaurant and stuff like that. So that's infill lot, right? The infill lot is going to change in value based on the population and the car count. So if that area is popping more and more, this year, it might be 102 years old, I might be worth three might be worth. So as the population grows, guess what it expands into more land. So the trick is, is if you find your sweet spot, you just kind of move as the population grows, and there's always more opportunity as the population grows in certain areas, because it always stretches out to more land. 22:46 Got it? Got it. Okay, there's, 22:49 there's a couple of varying factors. So like infill lots, if you're selling to builders, we have plans to sell to builders that do tentative see deals a month, they look for infill lots in Florida, because there's Florida is already cut up into small like 15 100,000, square foot lots, maybe 10,000 square foot lots, and they'll come in by him, they already have a buyer that's gonna buy 10 Lots this month, and they'll have another buyer, and five last month, guess what they buy it, but they buy it both at 40,000. So what they do is they reverse wholesale, if they know their buyers gonna buy this for 40,000. I'm going to contact every seller that has this type of Lot and offer them 25. And if they take 30, I'm gonna make 10,000 per hit, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. And there you have a buyer lined up, hey, I got another one. Boom. Imagine, imagine if you already knew the price, you're going to wholesale it. And you just making yours doing marketing. So I have clients that do this in Florida doing 10 to 20 deals a month. 23:39 Great. Wow. Wow. Wow. So So why are we doing houses? 23:46 I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. 23:51 Right, right. So now and how long have you been doing the land? I don't think we asked you about your land for four years. Okay. Okay. And so you said that's your one house the House did you did that was your personal residence was the only house that you ever did. Right. So with that in mind. Now, are you doing lots in different areas of the country or are you focused on a specific area? 24:18 So our niche specifically is what we try and do is we're doing 50 acres or more all over Texas. We'll look at the tickers more nationwide. It's just where our sweet spots Texas we got buyers, we got private capital we got title companies. We have all these relationships here in Texas so we can do anything in Texas for two years or more. But we're looking people are throwing us deals in Oklahoma, Florida, all over the place North Carolina. We're getting deals thrown at us from other markets so we're looking at them but our sweet spots definitely Texas. 24:48 Great stuff great stuff. So again, one of the questions that I want to make sure that I cover because I'm you know, just thinking of what some of the, you know more inexperienced investors might Ask if you were given a property, you know, so you're just primarily in Texas. So if you got a house here in Atlanta that had an old house, old house on it, that needs to be torn down to be able to clear the lot. Is that something that you look at? One, two? If it is, how do you look at the cost versus the cost of tearing that property down? If you were to, you know, take on something like that, versus what you could potentially make on selling that lot. 25:33 Um, there's, there's a lot of, we don't, we don't really do that because like I said, we're doing we do theater for more like literally, we're looking at 100,000 Plus land tracks, we don't like anything under that. There is there's there's there's like different sub niches in real estate and land. As you know, like if you get into houses, you're doing Airbnb, you might do rentals, you might do short term rentals, you might do the burst strategy. With land, there's some features too, so that might be like a sub niche. So those of video I saw recently on Tik Tok, and it was like, out of like Seattle, or like Silicon Valley, and they showed this house like in 2008, it was just like a regular house. Somebody came in, tore it down, built like a modern home, and it was a lot bigger. And then literally five years later, somebody came in and tore it down again, and go to the convention, because they're gonna have went up in value that much that it was worth it to tear it down and build up a mansion again, because it was probably worth to the $2 million house at that point. So the value is in the land. So as the population I'm gonna see this in Florida, too. We did an event in Florida, end of August, in Florida, if you ever been by Miami, there's little rivers that cut to the ocean. And there's houses right on the corners, with yachts parked right on front. If you ever see them, sometimes they're tearing down those houses, the older houses, maybe 20 years old, 10 years old, and putting like mini mansions because it's location, location, location, location, it's very, very important, especially for stuff like that. So like, they'll come in and build a mini mansion, park their yacht out front. And now they got a brand new modern build, built this year, or whatever to their specifications with the out front. And it's all about that corner lot being specific location. So like when it comes to land is one of those things where like, if a buyer wants it buyer wants it because they might like that location, they might want a pond to throw fish in it to go fishing all the time on their land, they might want, they might want acreage to shoot on their land, they might want to do recreational stuff. So the one thing about our buyers is they they're people that buy land, there's no utility with it. So they're usually ready to spend money. Whereas houses it's a necessity, they might rent it, they might rent it, they might look in for cash flow, like who's but who else buys land and people that can afford to? 27:38 True? True? Absolutely. And I guess, you know, just thinking of the question that will potentially be asked in a situation like that. The short answer is, why tear down a house, there's plenty of land, there was no houses, right? 27:53 That's why That's why like half burned houses, they just let them sit because there's, there's no like that whoever buys that property has to get a really good deal. Because they're getting paid out by the insurance by the by the fire damage. And they have to come in and clean it out. So they're actually spending money. So they have to get that deal almost free, which is like people that buy properties, like I'll give you 10 grand for that lot. Because I still have to come in and tear down, maybe tear down half the house, remediate it, and build back up again. 28:22 Good stuff, good stuff. So, so the average lot size. Now you're saying 10,000 acres, like we said 50,000 acres, right? And this was just in Texas that you're looking at 50 acres or more years or more. Okay, okay. So it's nothing so you're not looking to sell your wholesale land or lots that are just for single houses you're looking for, like subdivision type projects, is that correct? 28:49 We're not even doing subdivisions. So our whole strategy is to sell ranchettes with a ranch that is 10 acres or more. So if you do subdivision, it's a lot more it's a lot more of a process to bring bringing the roads to bring utilities, you have to bring in shovels, we're just we're flipping paper. Like a lot of people like Oh, I'm gonna develop this land. I'm like, why it's gonna take nine to 12 months, you know, it's gonna happen in 12 months. I don't know 29:19 what happens in the you know, we're in a recession, and we're in a crash. I say that facetiously because, you know, so many people are, you know, hands up in the air about stuff like that. If people knew anything about the crash of 2008, they would clearly know that we're not anywhere near that now. So I'm joking in that way. But in the sense of something like that, how does lots in land are how are they affected in a recession or a crash? Are they affected in any way and then you know, buying and selling, 29:53 so I will 100%? I don't know, because I've only been on this for years. I mean, I was I was six Teen when suddenly happened. Like I was I was, I wasn't even looking at real estate, I was looking at girls, you know I didn't I didn't know about this back then. So what I've heard is that land is very, it doesn't flex at all from the recession type thing, because all our buyers are coming in cash. And if we're offering financing, they're still going to have cash to buy land. So like one of our one of our one of our buyers, he actually buys mobiles and mobile homes. So like from him is he's a mobile home, and he shall buy land from us put mobile homes on it and sell it again. So that's his whole niche. So we're working with people actually have capital that do business, in the land business, to make profit, or for leisure, so they have capital, 30:48 great stuff, great stuff. So and just you know, and for the people that are sitting way, in the back, we'll make sure you're clear, we clear the air on that. People that are primarily investing in land are ones that have the capital to do it. Right. And looking at the overall, you know, I mean, you gotta be liquid in some way or another, to be able to do that and look at the long term benefits of purchasing the land, you know, from the person that why the person is actually investing in it. But from a wholesale perspective, you just have to have these people in mind when you're marketing, these types of projects. 31:27 So a lot of people that project, a lot of people like projecting their own insecurities on their sellers, which you gotta think about, like, like, oh, I would like who would buy this? And like, there's people out there that buy boats? What do people do with boats, they leave it in the slip for six months and go out once a month? 31:44 Absolutely. 31:47 So you can't be can't project your own insecurities, what people would do. 31:53 I couldn't agree with you more, you know, people buy rocks as pets. So I mean, come on. So you can limit what someone will or is willing to invest in, as long as it benefits them in a way or another. So absolutely, I totally agree with that. So and I don't think you may have answered this question. But I want to just circle back to get an idea. You said you drove you drove trucks previously. Right? And then of course, you have this huge data company. Why land? You may, you may have asked to answer that question. But I want to make sure I'm clear. Why did you get into wholesaling make sure I want to make sure I'm saying it, right? Host selling lots and land. Why did you decide to do that? 32:41 It was I me and my partner, we both kind of fell into it. We didn't know this niche was out there, too. We kind of felt land deals. And the crazy thing about this, if you talk to like any experienced real estate investor, they've done at least one land deal. And I've had this conversation multiple times with multiple different people, like oh, yeah, I did. I've done a land deal. It was like the biggest check I've ever made. And I'm like, Okay. And like, it doesn't click with them. And they're like, we'll talk to like, we'll talk to like businesses that we I did an interview. I'm not gonna put his name on here, but I did an interview. And they're like, they have, they're doing the podcast, big office behind them. They got 3040 employees, they do 200 transactions a month. And they're like, so like, how many transactions do you guys do? And I'm like, we're trying to do like, maybe five to 10 a year. And he's like, and he got like, he got like the stinkface that mean? And I looked at him and I'm like, like, We're trying, like, our goal next year is to do 10 $1 million deals. Yeah. So most people are like, the most people. It's like a competition. I do 10 deals a month, I do 20 deals a month. I have 300 doors. But what's the cashflow look like? So for us, it's like, it's not even a competition of like, how many deals per month you do, or how many transactions do you do? I'm trying to do bigger and larger deals. I'm trying to create more cash flow than you and all your doors have in one transaction, where it's yours to compile. And we're trying to do this all with doing 10 deals 10 deals a year, you know, like we're trying to be more effective than proficient. 34:21 Right, right. Right, right. Yeah. The quality over quantity type of situation. You know, if you do 10 You probably make as much as those guys that do 2020 deals a month. Listen, I get it. I'm slammed ducking my way out of this thing. 34:40 It's crazy, because like every time I look like big operations, I'm like his churn is gonna be crazy. His rental incomes gotta be crazy for that office, like your overheads insane because you have all these employees and I'm like, I'm trying to stay lean, and we're trying to maximize profits. And like one of the big things like you always hear about like, oh, how do you the average wholesale spread is like 17 grand And as of like, a few months ago, so like, if you're trying to make larger spreads, you target more expensive property. It's just zeros. It's the same price as the small transaction. So like I have clients that do all these infill lots, and I'm like, it's, I'm happy for you. Like, I have a, I'm happy for them that they're doing all those transactions, but I'm like, you can be more effective. 35:25 Yeah, yeah. No, it makes sense. It makes sense. I mean, if you don't have to do it. Now. Now, this is this is an ironic situation, though, I have to say, Daniel, because you are the person that has the CRM for the guy that's doing the 20 deals a month. But you only do let you only do one or two deals. 35:45 easily use a CRM. See, the thing about this is that the CRM amplifies what you can do. So like, if I can do one deal, one deal a year, Google Voice and paper, all for you, man, it's all free. But I can actually amplify and do more transactions and be more efficient, no matter what I'm doing as a whole. Because we still do a lot of texting. A lot of my outreach that we use our system for is for selling our deals, and who do we text with text agents, because agents have buyers? If you text enough agents, somebody's gonna have a buyer for you. And they're happy to make the seaward the commission. So we just we just in on that, hey, we'll pay your commission and just bring a buyer and like, Oh, yes, I have a buyer. We're gonna go. They're just doing backflips and stuff like that for 3%. 36:29 I'm like, Okay, right. Right. Right. So So is it true that they can make up to 10%? 36:36 They can. It depends on the lot. So usually, when it comes to like smaller loss, I usually ask for 10%, because there's no value in it. The story of my first deal that I did, the agent, I, so I still got a marketplace in two days. And the buyer, I negotiate everything, the buyer the contract, and the buyer had called an agent to represent him. And the agent called me and I'm like, I'm gonna work with an agent, you only want to pay commissions. And I was laughing because I sold the slot for $12,000. She called me and she's like you would you pay commissions? And I'm like, you know, what, what's 3% of 12? Grand? You know what? I'll pay commissions, you know, we can have your $300 37:22 or 60,000? Like, 37:24 it's just like, can you pay 500? And I'm like, as long as you get the transaction done, I will pay your 500 bucks. Just make sure that connection flows smoothly, just like thank you so much. And I'm like yeah. Oh, he's really close a bigger lot. So used to taking the 3% Commission, because it's a lot more it's like a regular house, you're dealing with 200,000 or more properties, you know, they're making regular commission, when it comes to smaller lots using asking for more because like, this is where it comes down to people are just smarter lots. If you're doing a lot for a grand, it's not even worth doing title, because you might spend more on title than actually purchasing on the land. Yeah, yeah. So there's people out there that will teach you how to do your own title search to self closed that deal. Because if you do 1000 of those over your lifetime, that might save you 100 grand or a million dollars, you know, 38:14 good stuff. Good stuff. So now, now that you mentioned title search, now do you find and what I what I most have what I'm so in my experience, I'll be honest, in 24 plus years, I probably have three land deals. And I want to say two and a half out of those, those are the you know, the average of those three, two and a half. I had title issues where it was, you know, handed down to the family. And you know, we had like 10 people that had to sign off on it and all these other things. I think one was actual probate situation. Have you run into anything like that? Or what is the, you know, kind of the worst situation you've had with dealing with these types of deals. 38:59 That's in Texas, if you have a problem, anybody listening, you can contact us? Well, we actually deal with that we bought part we love parcels of property. That's our specialty in Texas, we're there to solve problems. So the bigger problems solved, the more you get paid. So like those issues that come up. We're ready for them. Because we're in this niche. They come up all the time. So we're ready to deal with airships. We're ready to do a partial interest. We're ready to do a partition sale and Sue, that brother doesn't want to sign because he's not getting his portion. So like it doesn't really matter. As long as somebody wants to sell the property that's inherited the property, we're willing to buy that 20% of the property. 39:35 Okay. So you haven't had one of those situations where you know, they're fighting him. 39:42 We've done it. We've done a bunch of them. We've done deals in prison. Oh, wow. Okay. The seller out of prison before, so we've done a lot of crazy stuff like that, and sex. Wow. Like that stuff. That stuff, the stuff we have to deal with. It's one of the things if it comes across we're ready for 39:59 it. Great stuff, great stuff, let's say, you know, if it's, if it's gotta be a big deal, it's got to be a Texas they say, Do it do a big Texas? Yeah. Right, what is what is the what is the, I don't want to I want to get more, you know, like kind of like these, this process of what you've seen in some of the titles. So you said there's people that teach you how to do the title search. Like if you had a scenario where there was, you know, 10, or more siblings or 10 or more people involved in the transaction. 40:35 My, my partner does a lot of that stuff. We I think we didn't want with eight heirs, we did one with one out of the country, where we had to send them to, we had to send them to a embassy in another country to do a notary. We've done stuff with them. So we don't we did a lot of crazy stuff like that. We had a we had a lady deed over us do this over a property, just so we can sell it because she was lived. She lived in China, she was a teacher in China. Wow, wow. And she's really deeded over the property to us. And we sold it on the MLS and paid her off her free. Because she did. Virtually. 41:13 So So in that situation. I mean, did she just I mean, she just trusted you to give her the money, or did y'all have some type of agreement that would pay her back, or 41:23 she trusts us to give us the money. So that's the crazy thing in my lane, some people will just give it to you. Alright, very toxic people, some people just give it to you. One of my clients did a deal the other day, they're like, Hey, you can have it, if you pay the taxes off the package, like two grand send it over. And I think I think my client ended up giving her like 500 bucks, like, I have to give you something for it. So give me like 500 bucks, pay the taxes got a property returning 100 bucks. 41:47 Wow, wow, wow. And I could see how something like that will be as you mentioned earlier, you know, there is no cash flow to it. And you know, you have to pay the taxes on these things. And sometimes people just tap out, you know, they don't have a plan for it. So eventually, you know, those taxes become, you know, overwhelming and, you know, maybe they don't have a set of heirs to pass it on to or maybe they don't care to pass it on to the heirs. So I can I can see that the other situation where they just give it up, you know, and not have to pay the taxes on it. Have you seen that quite a bit? 42:20 It happens a lot. I mean, the people target that tax assessor list in general. So one of the one of the benefits about tax lists is for everybody listening, no matter what list, you're targeting, the tax, this is a huge list. Everybody has underlying motivation. The reason why is because if it's on the taxes, if it's a house, guess what, there's no mortgage, because a mortgage is always going to make sure the taxes taxes are paid. So it's a how it's free and clear, if it's land he's got might be minimal taxes on that property, but it might be worth a lot. So a lot of a lot of the tax assessed value are usually way behind what it's actually worth. So we use that as like a negotiating tactic sometimes to get into properties where like, hey, it's XYZ says this is that we're on where you're at. And we know it's worth maybe one and a half percent or 150 or 200%. What is actually text value is So, like an anchor, and most sellers come to us you asked what the tax value for it because I think that's what it's worth. Right? Perfect. 43:20 Good stuff, good stuff. Alright, so how do you how do you what's the process that you go by to generate leads for these types of projects for these types of deals for the lead? 43:32 So we do a lot of texting, which is through our software, we do PPC through our software. And we do Oh look. You got some good comments. 43:44 What in the world is that? Okay. 43:49 Okay. Yeah, they'd love 43:54 to chat. Right? Right. So gotta get rid of that 44:03 we did texting, we do PPC, and we do referrals. One of the big things about being online is if you talk loud enough people will send you deals for free so we tell all of our people that all of our people that want to do land just like tell everybody to do land just because it's so niche people whenever somebody comes across that they're just gonna call you and there's so much opportunity out there that you just say I do land I do land land. And specifically if you want to be specific about it, do I do certain Cyper land I do info outside do large acreage I do this that way everybody whenever things land Oh, I know that guy. And we just get we've been meeting Anthony going on the on the land the land proclamation for a while. So people just DMS deals all day all day long. So we get a lot of referrals. 44:45 Oh, wow. Wow. So what is the lead conveyor belt? 44:50 The lead conveyor belt is where you put your leads to the cheapest form of process. First, down the line. So email, texting, texting RVM call clubs that takes physical man hours and, and physical time. And then you might do direct mail, you might do door knocking or something behind that just to physically talk to that person. So like, you can be so niche targeted with your list that like, I'm going to talk to this person no matter what it takes, and you can be direct with that, where you're going to target specifically to target that person. 100%. 45:19 Got it. Got it. Got it. So with all of that, you still are only looking to potentially do 10 deals on an annual basis. 45:28 Yeah, we just said 10 deals, but I think we have like five minimum, we have about $5 million under contract right 45:32 now of land. Wow, wow. Okay. Okay. So is there a number that you'd hit that you'll take the rest of the year off? 45:40 No. I mean, we're getting so many leads thrown at us, or like, we're just gonna keep doing this, like 10 is just the goal. But if, like we're we just bought 123 acres in commerce for 175,000 were listed at for six. We just tanked. We just contracted 211 acres and 54 acres in Pleasanton, Texas. And then we got a two acre lot and Natalia for 50,000 that were selling for 140. 46:09 Wow, wow. Right. So I mean, you'll hit your goal pretty easily. And then, you know, continue to do. 46:19 If you just like working out, if you work that if you work out that one muscle, you do curls, your biceps are going to be huge. So we're looking at big land deals, because we're going to be the best at it. And we're just looking at it all the time. So if you got any big land deals, you can submit it to submit big And we're looking at it 46:36 good stuff. Good stuff. So what now in your in the United that you said you tell people that you do land? Right. So you That's most of the things that you promote? So of course, you that's the thing that you promote amongst people. So in I imagine in your networking, that's the conversation why why is it Why is networking important? And how does that help with doing the deals that you do? 47:00 Most people that we literally, we talked to tie flip, man. Okay. And we interviewed in the funniest conversation. He's like, You guys do land like, yeah, I have so many landlines. I don't even know what to do with. You want to work you want to know. Yeah. Okay. So we literally we interviewed on our podcast last Thursday, we just contracted a deal with him a week later, because he already had the leads in his inbox. 47:28 Great stuff, great stuff. 47:30 We're looking to make $30,000 on a deal. He already had it in his in his in his lead pipeline that he just didn't touch because he didn't know what to do with it. And we're on it already. And that everybody has leads in the pipeline that they just come across? If they're if they're doing consistent marketing, they just have leads that haven't touched for whatever reason. 47:50 Definitely, definitely, definitely. And you're absolutely right about that. And I want to make sure, you know, folks are clear on that. If you are doing consistent marketing, I mean, just like you said, if you're doing consistent marketing, these there should be leads that either A, you haven't figured out what to do with them yet. Or there's some unnecessary follow up that needs to happen with them, you know, or see, you're simply you know, you haven't again, network with the right people to be able to get them to fit their specific niche. So, so Absolutely, I agree with you. 100%. 48:24 So, so, networking, telling people about it, people think of you first 48:29 true story, true story. Alright, so we're coming up on our time, but I want to ask what is what is the worst experience you've had in your multimillion dollar four year run that you've been on in real estate? Um, 48:44 I've had, I've had a few and I talked about this recently. This is that this is when I had too big like slaps in the face before I got my first deal. And I like being with the story because like, this is like crazy, crazy story. So my first one is, I found a seller. He was under a pre foreclosure. He had family living in his property, but he didn't want to deal with them, because they're a family like he knew them. But they didn't. They stopped paying his rent. So he stopped paying the mortgage, pre foreclosure hit, and he's just, he's just stressed out. So I was like, let me let me work from it. Because I'm not I don't know, I don't know you. I don't know him. Let me just work at my side. So I talked to the family, they didn't want to move out. So I'm like, Hey, I have to evict them. You sign this paperwork saying I'm a victim. Alright, so I wanted the courts filed an eviction with mountain cash. I've never done an eviction to this day. That was my first eviction I ever did never did real estate more than the whole process of eviction through through the fire evicted family, I trashed it out. Because of course, when you evict somebody, they don't actually leave it clean. So I got my buddy, we just thought we filled the whole dumpster full of their stuff, trashed it out, cleaned it out, took it to the closing table, because mind you I was still in the contract at this time, because I had a buyer and the buyer wanted to trashed out. So to get the ticket to closing we're go the closing table and the closing attorneys like there is a $30,000 credit card lien that we can't release. What the tilt table right blew up the deal right on the table. Wow. I was I was depressed. Like, I've been gonna make a 20,000 on that one. And wow, I thought I was gonna go to title and walk home with Jack and I went to title and went home with nothing. 50:31 So so that wasn't something that came up in Title before you got to the closing table. 50:36 They never so this whole this this title company never ran the title search because I guess they weren't a lot of bad wholesalers. So they're ready to tell you ready to close. So he literally ran out of that morning. I did all this work for weeks. And they fooled right in front of me. 50:54 Wow, wow. Yeah, that's, that's not good. So could you have me in a scenario like that? What I've what I would have attempted to do was maybe have the buyer finance my fee over time, like Yeah, well, maybe you don't pay me now. But, you know, put me on the end of the deal when you sell it. You know, maybe I'll make a little bit there. But they still would have had to cover the 20 year 20,000 plus an additional 10. So 51:23 yours too, because it was left in disrepair. So like it totally blew up the numbers of the repair because we're I never did a subject to do but that wasn't supposed to be a subject to wholesale Oh, there wasn't enough spread on that deal as a whole to finish it out. And add another crazy one to the I work I found this once I found out about real estate look for vacant properties like looking for vacant properties and the low that's money there. So those are house I passed on my way to and from work. I saw it twice a day for two years. And then I learned about real estate and like okay, there's this house that I've been talking about for the past two years that I can contract so the guy ended up living like to 20 minutes south of me which is like country. So I ended up pulling out his house and it was like a bunch of like it looked like not wholesome folks on the porch and regulars crack house. Man and the the grandchildren are taking advantage of the of the grandfather because he had a house. So they're, they're running stuff through the house. Because he was old. He was elderly there. So he's like, oh, I want to show you the house. So he's like He made me there tomorrow. So mind you, this guy's like 85 He almost falls down the steps because it's full of debris. Remember, lived on the property and trashed it. They just trashed like the outside of the garage. I get inside the house. I we couldn't find the key because he hasn't been there like 20 years. He's like he's like is it okay if I break in so I break into the property. And inside is immaculate it's 110 year old house. five bedroom five bath with like seven fireplaces. It's like an old old home in Georgia like old and we ended up I ended up contracting or paying 100 grand for it. I thought it was worth about 330 Somebody I'm gonna make a killing on this deal. On the buyer buyer lowball being like this is still my first deal and like okay, I'm just gonna take whatever they get because I'm I'm not pickers beggars can be choosers, I need this money right now. Whatever it is. So I had a buyer come in at 25. I want 25 to buy this property. And literally, we're supposed to close on a Monday, the seller passed away on a Friday 53:45 from a stroke. Wow. Wow. And and I guess it wasn't handed down to anyone, right. 53:57 I mean, it was one of those things where like, we're definitely not closing. Because yeah, no probate and all this stuff. And like when's a good time to contact them? Because I don't want to be like, Hey, I was about to buy this property. But your your grandfather died or your father died, like, like, I don't want I don't know when to have the conversation. So let me just file a memo on this property. And then I'll come back to me is what I thought. So I waited for it to come back ended up somebody closed on it, like a year and a half later around my memo. And wow, wow, they sold it for 100 grand and this is like, Peak Peak. Peak COVID where it was like the huge run were about 350 that pass probably went like 450 easily maybe even five because it was so it was like it was like almost 4000 square feet. It was a mansion like a mini mansion. 100 year old 54:46 that's something else man. I know that had to burn. What I would have said, Listen, you know, somebody's got to pay for grandpa's funeral. So let me do it. Just give me the house. 54:58 I didn't I didn't have any money in I was broke back then. I don't even know what to do like, what do you do? Not really have any mentors? 55:09 Right, right, right. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, you're right. Yeah, that was one of those situations where you had to figure out what to do. That is something else. Yeah, forgot my son was getting out of school early. Wow. So So now that you've had the experience that you've had in doing what you're doing, I mean, I can see, you know, where and these are the these are the types of things that, you know, we talked about on the show, real life, real estate investing, where people have these experience, you know, and then we talk about the solutions to those types of scenarios that they come up with. Because, you know, oftentimes people get into the business of real estate and they miss that there are going to be it's inevitable and what we do, because there's so many moving parts, there's there are going to be some issues that you run into, right, but it's not what happens to you, because what happens happens to us all, it's how you respond to those things that happen to you. And, you know, I see that you what you've done is that you've turned those experiences into a greater testimony, I guess we'll call it with the experience that you now have in land. What would you say to the, you know, aspiring investor, so you know, someone that's coming along, either to dictate given the business of real estate or to get into the real estate, by purchasing or selling lots and things like that, what would be your advice to a person who's trying to get into the business, 56:44 just be consistent, I know, there's probably gonna be a lot of wholesalers not going to be here. And then I in the near future, just because they're not continue to stay in it. I got, I got hit in the face a few times. And I'm still here, because I had no other choice and opportunity to, as well as things were like when you back when you backed up against a wall, either either die, or you don't 57:05 put your story to story. 57:08 And this was things. And this is the crazy thing about entrepreneurship is like, what separates everybody else from entrepreneurs is they start, what separates people that start to everybody else after that point is they're consistent, and they keep moving forward, no matter what happens. And I always make I've made a tweet about this a couple weeks ago, but it's like, if you survive long enough, in entrepreneurship, you'll get to where you want to go. 57:33 Yes, yes. Yes. And that's it. You know, the only thing I'll add to that, Daniel, honestly, is that what you said is the consistency part, you know, and knowing that, if you already expect that there's going to be something that could potentially happen, I would now always say, expect great things to happen. Expect great things to happen, you know, because what you put into the atmosphere is usually what comes that comes back to you. Right, expect great things to happen. But don't be taken aback if great things don't always happen. Right? When you want it to. Exactly, exactly. 58:11 overnight success usually looks like five to 10 years. Right? 58:16 Right, and depends on the you know, even the experiences along the way, you know, someone's level of you know, quote, unquote, success might not be the same as the next person, you know, that the success is the experience and how I look at it. It's not always just the money or, you know, I believe the experience in what you obtained over the time that you've been involved in something. I mean, like you said, you've only been doing doing this for four years. But look what you've accomplished, right? That will be considered a level of success. Now, someone else may say, you know, like the gentleman that, you know, says that he does 20 or 30 deals a month, you only do 10 a year. who's successful. Right? Perspective? Absolutely, absolutely. But listen, I want to thank you for definitely, you know, spending the time with us today, you gave us some very, very valuable information. And I'd like to invite you back on you know, just to share with share with us some more insight, you know, some of your experiences now throughout the, you know, what you're doing with with lots and land like that, because I know some people are gonna want to learn more about that. In the meantime, how do people get in contact with you if there's questions or maybe you know, maybe someone wants to learn from you how to get involved in doing lots. 59:33 So, we do a lot a lot. If you can't find us, you're not looking hard enough. We're at hive mind serum on every platform. We have our own podcast tuner for the episodes called hive this podcast network. We do. If you want to learn more about big land deals, we have a land mastermind you should Tex land to 210-972-8042 you want to learn how to make six figures on a deal on one land deal just six course So we provide a lot of a lot of content and a lot of information out there as a whole. We just did 1000 videos on YouTube yesterday. So that's not enough to get your get your tastebuds. Let me know. We're making more. 1:00:13 Absolutely, absolutely. And and as far as the CRM, you know, with hive mind is that so hive mind is Hive Imagine 1:00:24 had mine CRM the IO. See, okay, 1:00:27 okay, that's right, I did, I did have that in my notes. But I'll make sure we have that, you know, in, you know, when we when we post everything, so people can get in contact with you that way as well. Any any parting words you want to share with the audience before we get off? 1:00:44 I mean, I got a few. I mean, there's a on my show, I always like what's a quote, that's yours or somebody else's that you resonate with. And I got a few of those. So it's, you build your infamy off the content you produce. And I've just seen it happen that like, if you want to, if you want to, if you want to make a difference, just start producing content, bad or good, will get better over time, just produce? And then the other one is, you only you only have one name treated accordingly. 1:01:09 Absolutely. Absolutely. Man. That's, that's, that's worth the worth the show, right? They're worth the content of the show, you know, for people to understand that you only have one name treated accordingly. Now, I always tell people that come on my show, Dan, or people that I talked to the first time I use your quote, I give you credit for it the second time as my 1:01:32 I have another good one. This is my Well, my partner said yesterday, he says either either succeed or you have excuses. You can have both. 1:01:39 Absolutely, absolutely. Real talk. You can't you can't take you can't take excuses to the bank is what they tell. You go. Alright. Right. Thank you. Again, thank you for joining us today. I certainly appreciate you taking the time and certainly appreciate you sharing the great information that you share today. In spite of those additional comments that we had, I don't know where those came from. 1:02:03 Right. So you don't see it. All right, Daniel. Thanks again for being on the show. Folks. This has been the real life real estate investing show where we talk about real life real estate situations, but really real life real estate solutions. Thank you for watching. Look forward to seeing you real soon.

Daniel Esteban MartinezProfile Photo

Daniel Esteban Martinez

Host/ Ceo/ Speaker

I have been an entrepreneur since 2018. I come from a regular home just like most people. My dad worked on the roads in the Chicago area for over 30 years. He always taught me to work with my brain, instead of my body. Your body can only take so much abuse. I learned so much from my father. He always pushed me to work smarter and not harder.

I have owned and operated a trucking business for 2 years. I started learning real estate in 2019. Fell into the Data & Skiptracing business in 2020. My partner Anthony & I started Hivemind in 2021.

I have done a ton of different jobs coming up from painting, to door-to-door sales, telemarketing, truck driving, and loading trailers. What I learned most is that I want to stay in the digital business space. The leverage you can have delivering digital products to the marketplace can yield limitless possibilites.

I started The List Guys in 2020. It is a data and skiptracing service. We provide seller and buyers list nationwide. My clients have been getting great results and I am proud to help people killing it.

I started the Hive in 2021 with my partner Anthony Gaona. It is a real estate and business mastermind. It also comes with a all in one CRM, that can host unlimited websites and users.

Starting the Hivemind has been an amazing journey so far. Seeing one of our users make his 6 figure month in June 2021 leveraging our software, I know there will be plenty more to come!