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Oct. 20, 2022

Ep 244: Negotiating Masterclass With Max Jimenez

Ep 244: Negotiating Masterclass With Max Jimenez
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0:34 Hey welcome to today's show. The music could off soon I guess we're gonna fix this for kind of funny the first time I used it ease of use the other one but Anthony does not like that other sound. So I was against it. And I was the first time we ran it so it's kind of interesting seeing how like a 0:47 lot better, like better Okay, 0:49 so today we have a special guest Mr. Max Jimenez not going to really do it begins on him, but his name carries his own weight. So Mr maximun is here today. We're here live. If you have any questions, please put it in the chat. We're here in a lot of fun channels. So if you guys have any questions, put it here. We're gonna have a great conversation today. I met Max three years ago. It's been busy. 1:16 Yeah, what up fellas, thank you for having me on, man. I really appreciate it. Anthony. Thank you, Daniel. Thank you. It's a pleasure to be on here. I know Daniels been chasing me down a little bit not literally right. But you know, trying to get me on the show and we were all super busy. And ya know, Daniel, you're right. I think we known each other for a couple years now. So I really appreciate you all for inviting me and having me on the show and q 1:39 i did the invite watching on YouTube man I'm like man, this guy knows this shit. So I'm just driving around listen to your calls and all that stuff. And then I immediately recombination the wholesaling live with hbhs. I saw him in the bathroom. And I'm like, Dude, we gotta get you on a podcast. And it was pretty cool. It was kind of awkward. But like, man, like I had 2:04 to jump on that happen though, is we were talking about that backstage. Right? Do whatever it takes people you know, if you want to do something, you'll find a way. If not, you'll find an excuse. That's Jim Rome right there for you, by the way. 2:15 A long time coming. And we appreciate you being on here. I'm really excited about today. Nice. 2:20 So one of the craziest things I always like ask them because it's different. It's a different answer for every person, but like, how did you end up in real estate? Because a lot of people like some people, like fall into it. Some people like oh, it was the only thing I had to do and like, like, what what's your story of how you got into real estate? because ya know, for interesting because it you were like a mechanic, right? 2:39 I was in construction. Yeah. Construction. Yeah, yeah. Where are you? Okay. Yeah, so I worked as a commercial. We did commercial construction, which was the trade was doing plumbing, right. And it was, you know, as crazy as it was. I've always loved sales. And I always love entrepreneurship. And I've shared the story with a lot of people and they relate sometimes to it, because there's some times when you don't have the vehicle so you don't know what to do, right? You're like, Man, I have this drive, I have this passion to do something I have this passion to own my own business and I'm good at you know, itself. So I and so what happens I came to a point where I didn't know what to do. My stepdad had been doing it for a very long time. So I just said, You know what, let me go take this job to pay the bills right into to you know, for to pass on time. Well, that turned into six years. Five and a half years or whatever, like five to six years right? That that let me go pick let me go get this job to pay my bills turn about five years and, and right before actually, before I got that job is a friend of mine was already involved in real estate, but I didn't know like, I just knew it was awesome, because it gave him the what is it called the Freedom like the guy didn't work for anybody. And you know, he obviously did what he wanted traveled. And he was doing a lot of flips, he was doing some big luxurious flips and in the office that I was working in, so that always intrigued me I just thought you know, just like everybody else thinks like we don't know what you know, we don't know what we don't know which I need to have the money you know, I need to have the relationships I don't know all these people I don't have the money to be doing this but it always intrigued me. And so this was like around I want to say when I went and got that job because I didn't know what to do anymore. At that time I was actually selling credit repair. This was the time of the boom like when when people were getting qualified for houses they shouldn't have been ever gotten qualified right? So I would go to brokerages or not broker excuse me mortgage companies and I would do presentations how we can help your clients remove negative stuff off their off their files and stuff so and so so then that happens the that crash then I did a couple other gigs and then finally said I don't know what to do anymore. So I'm gonna go work here for a little while, but around that was around between like 2009 2010 and then in about 20 2014 You know, that's when the market starts to spike up. I don't know if you guys remember that. And so Around that time, I reached out to my We kept in touch with my friend that was doing real estate. And he got out of it obviously because the crash just like other people, right? He got he got he got, you know, wiped out some things. And he's like, Well he goes, I said, Hey, his name was Randy. I said, What? Have you seen the market turning? It's getting better. And he's like, What, uh, what do you think about us getting into real estate? Now I had the construction background, a little bit more money and more relationships. And so and so he's like, Well, let's do it. He goes, let's, let's see if you can, you know, let's start it. And that's what he told me. He's like, started, like, start what? I didn't know which way to go. But you know, one thing, Daniel and Anthony, I've always been very resourceful. And I always share this with people like throughout my life, bro. I've never, I've never lived in one location more than a year throughout my all my elementary years, like from grade from grade. Third, I was a great from third grade or fourth grade all the way up to eighth grade. Every single year, we will move around, bro. So you imagine what that does to someone, you got to adjust. You got to rebuild new friendships, you got to you know, I mean, so you have to. So I develop that, that, that, that, that mindset, and that tool came naturally to me because of my environment to be resourceful. So that's what helped me out in the long run, we can get a little bit into that if you like so, so then, so then what I did, I'm like, Okay, well, initially look for houses that are tore up, right. And I'll go back to him. And I started going on, on everywhere, right? I go, I went online, I would go to Craigslist, because back then in 2014, crazes was pretty prevalent. And so and I would go on Craigslist, and I see these properties, hey, buy this house as is like buy it as is, you know, but you got to close in seven days. And I'm thinking like, like seven days, I don't have the money for that. Yeah, so I always share this because I laugh because those were the wholesalers, right, knowing what I know now, those are the wholesalers that were posting the deals. And so you know, and again, I wasn't doing it, like very intentional at that time, it was more curiosity. Because I didn't know anything. I was just like, let me look for something. And I would go back to them. And the time went by didn't do much with it in 2015. 7:06 The entrepreneur bug hit me again, like, do I really want to continue doing what I'm doing right now? Which was the construction job, right? Like, is this what my life is gonna be? And there was some certain things that I looked at. And I said, Man, I really got to start doing something, I look over at my foreman, which you know, me and him hit it off really well. And I was like, he was only making, you know, he was making good money. But for the years that I was doing, I was I was up there as well, too. And I'm like, Man, I look at him. And I'm like, that's not what I want to be. And so I got really intentional. That's the one we got really intentional with, with how the way I took the way I approach like finding out more of how I can get into real estate. And so I ended up going all in on the vehicle real estate. Because again, entrepreneurship is very, I mean, right? It's huge. The problem with most people is that they got to find the vehicle, right. And I didn't know my vehicle for a very long time we're talking years, bro, I did yard sales. I wanted my own handyman, I sold stuff online, on eBay, I would go buy bulk downtown, and I would make quite a bit of money resell it like so. But then it started back up again and really just attached to real estate. And what happened was Daniel to kind of answer your question here. I just kept going, keep going. And my mother in law was like, you know, she's like, why don't you she saw what I was doing. She's like, I see you want to get in real estate. She goes, Why don't you call the agent that sold me my house. And I said, All right, let's do it. So this time kind of frustrated, nothing's going on, called her up. And she goes and she goes, You know what, I'm not longer and I'm no longer in your market. So I don't know how I can help you. And I'm like, Ah, okay. So then, you know, I mean, hit all these roadblocks and then right 8:43 now it's a dead end, dead end. Dead end. Dead end. Dead 8:45 end. Exactly. And then towards the end of the call, she goes, Hey, before we she was actually before, before I let you go, there is a guy you should look up. This is crazy brochures. Like, there's a guy you should look up in your market. He hoped he does event in his office and all that I said, Okay, what's his name? She goes, his name is Sean Terry. She's, I'll look him up. And I said, Okay. And I'm thinking to myself, Oh, here we go. Again, I gotta go look for another guy. So it's that impatient, right? Things aren't working. And so I didn't do it that night. I wrote the name down, put it away. The next day, I come home from work because I used to get out early, right, go in early, get out early. I looked them up. And then you know, he was like, number one on google Right? Like he wholesale flip to freedom and he had his podcasts and all that. And so I went on his website and I downloaded the ebook. This was probably early, I will say like around May, May of 2015. And so I downloaded the ebook, and I can kid you not my wife. My wife can attest to this. I read that ebook, like three to five times bro. I'm like What am I reading here? Like no way like that captured me. What he basically what he was saying how you take you know you take the The Purchase Contract A to B and then you would explain it, you sell it to B to C. And then you make your fee in the middle. And I just kept reading. I'm like, No way and the next day and I was so excited. I called my friend. I'm like, Randy, you cannot believe I found this guy. He's here in Phoenix. He said he could do this. You can do XYZ and hosts and this and that. And then he's like, is that legit? Is that you have to own the house. I'm like, not not, not according to him. Like, so that's that's basically how the journey started. And I started going to meetups and, man, I took off running from there, bro. And, and it wasn't challenges, right? Like it took me 10 months to get my first deal. And you know, me and Daniel, my son, you know, we were we were all involved. Me and Daniel go and put out bandit signs at 11 o'clock at night on Fridays. My wife and my daughter, they would do the letters for me put the stamps on. Yeah, bro, we grinded it and then boom, my first deal hit and I was like, let's go. And that's how you know i i went full, I actually jumped. I'll tell you a little bit about that transition before I went full time. But that's to answer your question. That's how I ended up choosing the vehicle for real estate. 11:06 It's, it's always interesting to see like people where people come from because like, a lot of people like it sounds illegal. It sounds illegal, but you don't know what you don't know. And then the other thing is Shawn's hairy man, Sean Terry influencing this many people like it's kind of cool to see where people's like web and people how many people it touches and affects 11:23 down the 100% Yeah, 100% I told them we actually had this conversation yesterday. Cory comes from that same tree. Cory Gary, same tree. Like honestly, I will never I would never say we're like, I don't have sorry. I'll never be proud to say that I learned from Sean Terry, right. Like he was the guy that taught me about wholesaling and pretty much changed the trajectory of where where I was to where I am now. 11:48 That's crazy. We have to figure out archery because we learned from Jaylen white. 11:52 Okay, yeah. He came from Sean Terry to okay, really? Yeah. Yeah, he was other meetups. I work with gentlemen. Why not work with him, but I would call him part try to partner up he was here in my market. And we did. We did a little bit of things here and there, but we never really didn't never really push through to get things going. But you're from the Sean Terry tree then. 12:16 I didn't know that's crazy. Yeah, that's 12:18 from Sean Terry. He was actually he was he's actually if you go to Sean Terry's podcast like years ago, like 2018 Maybe he's on their 18 year old or nine or 2019 year old kid makes 20 grand the first check or something like that. So 12:35 was it was gonna fire man, I think that's something that we pay attention to as well as, like, if we have this information, you know, you should spread it. Right. Because, you know, I see people maybe I went to high school with on Facebook and stuff and maybe they're not doing so hot. Sorry, I give you information. It's powerful information, like we should, you know, push it out into the environment, see who grasps onto it. I feel like personally responsible. Like, you need to tell somebody 12:57 you know, what's crazy Anthony about that is I was at an event and wholesaling. I don't know if you remember that. Daniel, back in 2019 in Houston, and I met this guy, Phil, Matt was Phil, and he was out of Pennsylvania. And the guy was low key, but he was pretty legit, right? And I met him and later on I met him at collective genius. I didn't know how legit this guy was. I was like, first met him and, and so he's like, bro, I follow you on Instagram. And you know, and you know, I see the things we're doing. He goes, I also follow Sean Terry, which is crazy, right? We keep talking about this. And I said so what's your Instagram? And so he gave me his Instagram bro and I went and had nothing on there. And I said your dude you're doing all this and this is your like, your Instagram this is back in 2019 and he goes yeah, Max you I just I don't like all that stuff. He goes I don't like like, the IG and all this and I said let me tell you something goes What's that Max? He was like, what do you learn from and then he tells me who learns from? And were you inspired when you found them? Like did you were you follow them? So like Yeah, man. That's how it was learned. He goes, Why don't you Why don't you be that person for the next person coming behind you? And his face kinda It was like he goes down he goes you got me bro. He goes I never never thought about it that way. Exactly. I said you said this is the thing this is why I always tell everybody those people that think that they don't want to share they don't want than they think they need to keep everything private. Like you learn from someone, somebody that you saw somebody that you that you know that you eventually looked at, like be that person to the next person that's coming behind you and sure enough, bro he took off and started sharing his journey and blew up. 14:39 That's amazing. And I love I love spreading that spark. I'll tell you for myself like I was just learning real estate. I was just learning how to get in the game but I have a 15 year marketing background so I got momentum pretty quick. And I kind of just you blow through enough leads you're gonna get some deals right? Oh, of course. Yeah. Of course doing was I was just joining all these different Facebook groups and I was just like commenting like, Hey, you should do this. Hey, Try this, Hey, should I do this? I was just like helping new people. Because I see like a lot of the veterans are like, some of the veterans were like clown on you people. So I wouldn't have these groups. And I would just comment and be like, Hey, you should try this, do this, do this. And I wasn't trying to get anything back out of it. But people started hitting me on Messenger like, hey, I need to do this. Hey, can you walk me through this here real quick? So I'm just helping a bunch of people. And then they're like, Hey, I got a deal. Can you JV with me? I'm like, Sure. Let's do it. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. But it started to pay itself back instantly, man, so I kind of caught that vibe is like if you if you help enough people, then eventually it pays you back somehow. And that's not why we do it. But that's exactly how it works. 15:36 Well, here's the way you gotta look at it, bro. Like, you know, when, when, you know, it's going to be more rare. But when you pass away, you can't use this information. You take it with you, bro. Like might as well, you know, I mean, like, it's not going to be used useful to anybody, right? I mean, obviously, you got to train your kids and different thoughts, different minds and all that. But there's, there's a lot of other people that can be was called that can use that information and, and run with it right? At the end of the day. It doesn't matter because I'm a big believer, like you said, right? You help you help enough people then to get what they want. And eventually, you know, it's gonna it's gonna come back no matter what, bro, it's, I've seen it happen so many times. I've helped so many people, and they're like, Max, what can we help you with? And I'm like, honestly, right now, I don't know. But I can guarantee you there's gonna be someone be stuck on and it happens, right? I call them back. Hey, guess what I remember last time you and I talked about failure into cash in that favorite role, but But you know, and because they say, Hey, have you ever anything reach out? But again, you know, you you got to get into that mindset, like, I can't take this information with me might as well just, you know, let it out and help other people to become to their full potential. Right. And that's how, and that's how you make a legacy. That's how you create your purpose, you know, by doing that. 16:54 So one thing I really want to hit on, because I know to the same subject you do you do weekly lives, right? Yeah. Yep. On the Instagram and the YouTube 17:04 man. Yeah, man. So what I'm doing I have a show called The closers. Lab. Right. So I do go on weekly on Thursdays 10am. Arizona time. 10am, Arizona time. So my you can find me on youtube under Max Jimenez. And then also on my IG, I drop a ton of content that's helpful and useful. If you're coming out trying to learn how to how to negotiate how to talk to sellers how to talk to just get better overall with your communication when it comes to sales, at real Max Jimenez that's my instagram at real Max Jimenez. And then my YouTube channel is Maximus. So I go live every single Thursday brother and I'm actually now on my Facebook group. I have a private Facebook group, where I do calls as well as to there's a little more private, where we pitch seller finance, where we talk about other things, strategies and all that. But man I've dude, like I've got people from Canada, the Philippines all around like not just in the country that have given me feedback outside of the country from how much the you know, the the, what he call it? The the closers lab has helped them to get better. I actually, I also do a masterclass and I bring this up because there's a guy there was a guy in there and this last one that I did and I asked him Hey, Rex, how did you hear about me? He goes, Max, you're gonna you're gonna laugh at this. And I'm like, no, what Tell me. He's like, this guy hired. He goes in the Philippines, which I just saw right now the Philippines, right? He's like, he's, he's he goes, this guy that I hired in the Philippines to do some calls for me. He actually brought you up. And I'm like, What, wait a minute. He's like, Yeah, he goes, dude, do you know Max human is like on the closers lab? And he's like, No, who is that? He goes, You gotta watch this guy. He comes on live every Thursday. He does the calls. He does. He tells you how to talk to sellers. Dude, I've been watching him. He goes for the past three months, and you gotta go and that's how he found out was like, Wow, that's amazing, bro. How much of an impact like and then the stories don't stop there, bro. They just continue continue. Keep going. I had two guys from Canada. Couple and right now we're obviously training some people from Venezuela. So dude, it's it's amazing, bro. It's crazy. 19:11 Are you then you mentioned something about the Venezuela team? Is that going to be something you're going to offer to the public or is that just for your company in house? 19:17 No, we are so it's going to be rolling now. It's called the closure system. I train them personally twice a week. You know that's not going to change because they're going to we're going to work last so I started training them in the beginning of August just to prep them and get them all into shape. And then for the month of December, they ended up locking up 11 contracts. So yeah, it was crazy. Amazing. I one thing about you have to remember about about virtual team members, right? Whether they're in Mexico, whether it's Venezuela, whether the Philippines where they're wherever they are in Egypt. So what happens bro is that they're not afraid to have that conversation, that difficult conversation, where people here in the states they get all wrapped up and have that mindset I can't ask the seller for a discount or I can't negotiate for them. It's like, you know what I mean? pretty firm conversation. I'm sorry. It's part of the process. It's part of the process. Exactly. Brother, it's part of the process. So I love that because I can work with that, like, and especially my style and the way that I that I train them, like, this is what you got to ask, here's how you're going to ask it. And you got to call that out. And they're not afraid to do that, right? They don't have any preconceived notion that that basically stops them from like, delivering what I just told him to deliver. I actually it's funny, because I laugh sometimes, like when I'm training them, like, Okay, here's what you're gonna go Santa, and they'll send me the recording. I like yeah, that's verbatim. I'm like, they didn't deviate from it. Yeah, but now, bro. It's It's amazing. Like, the virtual team is starting and starting to crush it. We're just getting started, bro. 20:54 So I really want to say something to this because I'm being I love Twitter, because it gives me like I always get a bunch of business stuff. Right? This was tweeted out this morning. This is someone with happier IQ is making 10x As you because you aren't smart enough to doubt themselves. Let's go baby. Right there because because a lot of people like they doubt themselves like Oh, sellers actually do that. So it's not going to do that. And the virtual assistants like yeah, I'm going to ask them anyway as part of this part of the system. 21:22 has crazy row. That sounds amazing. But yeah, we're going to we're that's rolling out our 90 page should actually come out today or tomorrow. And then we're gonna start providing that service. I'm actually training couple of them to be a coaches as well, too. So they're, some of them are advancing pretty quick. And so man, it's, it's gonna be incredible. We're about to we're about to put a industry what we're doing, bro. I'm super excited 21:46 about it. Do you have a link for that yet? 21:49 Not Yeah, bro. I know, you guys are asking me for all these links. So but you can text. But here's the thing. Here's the beautiful thing. My buddy Daniel, before we got on, he says he says Max, what are you doing? Slap me in the head. And he says we're going to create this for you. So if you are interested in in, and one of the other one of our closers, system, text the word closers. 22109721842. The word closers 22109721842. And what I'll do is just, you know, send you the information on and send you the link for it. So that way, you can start working on your closers, system. So and get you guys some deals, bro. 22:27 Let's go. Hey, Max, Can 22:28 we touch on this real quick before we bounce to each subject? Yeah. Talk about like the progression of somebody's real estate career. Right? So I feel like a lot of agents like they're not exactly marketing focused, right, like investors are because we're taught that way. Yeah. So can you talk about the progression of it, like when you're like a one man army, and you're trying to do everything, make all the calls, send all the text messages, you know, do all that stuff, to actually hiring a virtual team member and how that affects your business? And when it's time to do so as well? Should you be editing? Or should you already be closing deals? Or how does you know, when should somebody engage? 22:59 You know, after four and a half, almost five years of building teams, you know, myself as well doing a lot of stuff on my own. There is such a thing of hiring too fast and hiring too slow, right? So there's a balance in between so how do you balance that when you're first starting now, obviously, you got to generate your own activity, because you either have capital either gonna if you don't have capital, then you got to invest time capital, right, you have capital, which is money, time capital, which is going to require your participation always. And so what happens is that let's take SMS and CO calling for example, because you maybe you're not in a position to PPC or anything inbound. So you're gonna have to be the one that's going to be cold calling generating the activity, you're going to have to do the follow up and you're going to have to go to the sales appointments, right? Whether it's on the phone or whether it's in person. When is it time to hire when when when can you when can you look at where you're at and say okay, I think it's time to hire for me personally, I hired this is the way I would hire and how I would how I still hire even now, right? So if I if I if I'm if I'm doing the cold calling, I'm doing the follow up and I'm also doing the sales appointment. Number one, what I got to look at is is my is my is my cold calling my prospecting, starting to fill what is it called as a starting to lack because I'm doing too many follow ups. And I'm going to too many sales appointments. And what's happening is because I'm doing that I'm not prospecting as much anymore because I'm focusing now on following up with warm hot leads. And then I'm going to sales appointments where I'm potentially making offers. So if your prospecting is suffering, then it's time for you to hire a cold caller. It's time for you hire a VA that cold calls. I don't know why people try to hire acquisitions, people. acquisitions, managers first I think that's an absolute mistake if you don't even know how to do it right. So then what's the progression? Right you asked me that the next phase is okay, now I got a cold caller. They're doing all the prospecting for me. They're sending everything right. They're sending me an A you always use the baseball analogy. I'll tell you right now, there are now generating activities for me, I'm getting two to five leads per day now, right from my cold caller. Now I'm following up. And all I'm doing is I'm focusing on high level negotiation calls right? Now, what happens is that now you're going to start setting yourself up with appointments. And in high negotiation calls. If your follow up if your follow up is, is basically, again, remember what we said earlier about prospecting, if your follow up is suffering, right, because you're now you're now you're going to appointments that are where you're negotiating, making offers writing contracts, and then you got to go back and follow up and you got this big list. But yeah, you have more appointments to go to. Now it's time to hire a lead manager, right? So you got the cold caller, you do it, I can't tell you enough how much a lead manager changes your business? Because here's why my baseball analogy, okay. cold callers will send in everything right, those are your, your, you're on the ground balls, high ball corner sliders, right, and you're swinging at everything that's coming in. When you hire a lead manager, what happens is now you're gonna, you're gonna just swing it fast balls down the middle, do people still strike out with fastball down the middle? Middle? Absolutely. But guess what, they're a little bit higher quality, they're more, you know, I mean, they've been vetted twice. And then now you're just focusing on high level negotiation appointments, where you're going out and locking up deals, you got to take, you're starting to build a team behind you, you got a cold caller, prospecting generating people just that raise your hand, they're coming in to your lead manager, lead manager says Max got to get to this one, Max, this is the let me follow up with this. Don't worry about that, you got to go get this contract. And then next gets what's the next hire, this is where you're going to transition. If you're going if you can't keep up with your sales calls where you may, now you hire an acquisitions person. And that's basically, you know, that that's when you start to now you're going to have to build systems and process now, you shouldn't be doing it from the beginning, right? You shouldn't be building your system, which was a mistake that I did wrong. That's why I'm saying this, like, you got to do it. Most people think because they're on their own, oh, don't do it on frickin Google Sheets, like do it on Google Sheets. Because you're gonna get to a point you're like, oh, man, I grew. Now what I do, right? And there's always two problems in businesses is you don't have the systems, you have the people and then you have the system, then you find out you got the wrong people in place. Believe me, it happened to me, bro. I know, I'm telling you from experience, but that's the breakdown. You got to build the team, right? It's too many people try to scale too fast. You got to watch what you're doing. And you got to make sure that you're also staying laser focus. Don't everything that shines, you got to be careful with it, because and you got to look at it through a lens of does it take away from what I'm doing? Or does it improve upon what I'm doing? Those are the lenses that you want to look at when the shiny objects start to come at you pretty fast? Because they will? 27:51 Yeah, I think this is the business of shiny objects. 27:54 100% 100%. Yeah. Does that help? That makes sense? The breakdown on that, bro. 27:59 That's beautiful, man. Yeah, that's amazing. I hope if whoever's watching this, I hope you go back and watch the replay and listen to that two or three times because you are going to suffer. If you don't follow those steps, exactly, you're going to suffer, you try to grow too quick. You don't have the correct people in place, it's going to cost you a lot of time and a lot of money. And it's going to lead to a lot of dead ends. So I always recommend that somebody grabs up grab a mentor, I'm saying if magazine himself available, right? Or, you know, offering this these services, and somebody that's at a high level that's still willing to help, I would definitely take advantage of it because you have people that are at a high level and then I'm just too busy. I can't talk to you can't help you. Nothing. So yeah, 28:35 again, that's another conversation too, right? Because I think, you know, you get to a certain point where you can't scale anymore without actually mentorship, right? We've all had it. I mean, we've all had mentorship, I mean, Daniels come to came to our workshop as well. You know, I've paid so much money, right? Like even even, you know, I wouldn't be where I'm at if it wasn't for mentorship, but I know as you're starting out sometimes you're financially strapped right sometimes, like I said, you either have capital or you have time Capital One of the two you kind of have to, if you can play with, if you have money, man, by all means speed up your process, hire a mentor right away fast. But if you don't, then you're gonna have to invest taking action and that time capital, and you're gonna have to do pretty much a lot 29:19 of it. Yeah, that's what I did in the very beginning, man. When I first started in real estate, I hadn't even got a deal yet, but I was already a marketer. I started getting leads, and I'm watching all the people on Facebook and I'm kind of like this guy specializes in subdued this guy specializes in land disguise and self storage. So every time I generated a lead, I would call up that one person that I recognized and said, Hey, I got lead here. So at least I know I did some work, right? Yeah, I'm bringing something to the table. You know, 29:43 one thing I'm learning is not learning. Excuse me. One thing that I've always known as we're in a marketing and sales business, and one thing I've learned is that guys that come in with the background, background of marketing like yourself, for his black burden was a friend of mine. Very good for In a mind, those you guys like thrive in this business because that's what this business is. Marketing and Sales, right marketing and sales. And so a lot of people also make that mistake. You know, they Yes, the byproduct is real estate, but you're not really buying real estate, right? You're marketing and then you're selling. That's what you're doing. 30:19 Yeah, you can triple the deal. If you do enough marketing. You can trip over a 30:24 good deal. Yeah, well, 100% 100% Yeah, it's, you definitely can. So what is what's Leo say here? What is question? 30:34 Leo's question. 30:37 He's says, Max, I don't see you and Steve trying to merge together in more ways that are y'all still partners? Man? Where you been at Leo? I see you at every event and you're barely finding this out? No, brother, me and Steve, were not longer business partners. As of back in May we severed in so we went our own way. So yeah, I stepped away from that partnership. But 31:01 any questions on that? Okay. Cool. I was gonna ask you about when I asked you this at wholesaling live was? Why is it important to use a sale system? In a conversation? We're talking to sellers, because I really want to dig on this because you're the YOU'RE THE CLOSER you're the closer? Yeah. 31:23 I appreciate it. Man. That's a really, that's a really important question. As far as why do you have to build a sell system, right? There's a famous quote by David Sandler. And he said, Hey, he goes, when you're with a prospect, right, the prospect always has a system, right? And what happens is, that system does not say, salesman wins. What that prospect system says is sales man loses. So in essence, what he was saying is that every time that you go in winging it, that you do the meetings by the seat of your pants, where you try to close deals by Will and grid, which can give you some results, but it's not scalable, right? It's not, it's not something you can maintain and for long term. That's why That's why the, and here's how I'm gonna prove this. That's why the revolving door for especially for salespeople, and especially in acquisitions for real estate is so high, right? Three to six months, maybe three months, maybe six months, if you're lucky. So and what happens is people hire hire business owners hire people to come in to do sales, give them a scrip, and they think that that's going to give them success. So I'm a big believer why you need to have a sale system is not to control the conversation, but to orchestrate it right? You know, when we travel, we have what we call the GPS in our car, right? We get in our car, we pop in the address, and then it takes us to the destination we're going but what happens in that during that during that trip, remember this right? Especially if you got kids bro, like, you know you when you got kids, like they're gonna want to stop right? Dad up at the store, like, I gotta use the restroom, they're gonna do it right. So and then you might want to stop and sightseeing. Right? So so but guess what, when you get back in the car, what's that? What's that GPS? Where's it going? The same destination, it doesn't change. So this is why it's important to have that sales system because what I can tell you especially where our industry specific, our prospects are the sellers, right? The quote unquote, motivated seller, is there going to be providing information based on what they heard, what they see, there's nothing really that that's their system, right? And it's all defense mechanism. If you don't have a system to overcome that system, then you're going to get trapped and fall into that. And you're not going to have you're not going to have success to be able to repeat continuous. What is it called? wins and getting deals right? You ask someone that says How did you get that deal? I don't even know. Well, how did you get that deal? Man? How was it? Like? I don't know. They just said Yes, Max. Now repeatable right? So that's why it's very crucial and important. So that way, again, orchestrate the conversation. I had people with sound like Max, how do you control the calls, I'm like that you're already in the wrong mindset. I don't want to control the phone. I don't want to control the call. What I want to do is orchestrated so that way when I'm when I'm doing the calls, I want to get them to already know my destination, right? I already know where I want to go. And again, it comes from experience right based on what the prospect tells me because I have a system that I can put them through. Okay, this prospect engage? Is this prospect answering the question, answering questions, the statements that this prospect is making more sounds more like they're just looking for a number. This would this prospect just told me? I'm not going to continue the call. I'm ending the call right now. How Why am I able to do that? Because I have a system that tells me what I need to look for. 34:53 Yeah, I love the sale system because it's, it's a way to get repeatable results. 34:58 And there you go, rinse and repeat. rinse and repeat. Exactly. 35:01 It's so crazy. Like, it doesn't make sense at some points. But it's like you want to get repeatable results, you got to put somebody through the same process and get some get similar results that we can create a problem. Yeah, exactly. One thing I really want to talk about that I learned through you guys was not making an offer. Let's Yeah, I want to talk about this because a lot of people would like, for me, like, should I make an offer? Should I make offers in my shooting in the dark? And I like, I like hearing your position on this. I want to have this conversation about sharing Why Why or why not to make an offer? And when 35:34 at that point, I got to hear this, because as a rule of thumb, it's always like, always make the offer. 35:39 Yeah, no, look, I get it man. Like, you know, there's there's been businesses, successful businesses where they have, you know, where they have the key performance indicator of making 25 offers a day, right? And, you know, 30 offers a day. My problem with that is going back to what I said earlier, is that the reason? Why don't, why don't follow that key performance indicator, I'm more about conversations, right? Because the conversation is gonna allow me to find out if this person deserves an offer. That's more what I like to like to hit on. That's my high level is in a conversation for me as I'm the uncovering motive, uncovering timeline, right. And then I'm discovering if anyone else is involved in that potentially, once I have those three things I'm going to make that offer. And so So, but going back to what I was saying about having the key performance indicators and making x amount of offers per day, I don't think it does anything good for anyone, but besides probably bring you down, because you're like, dang, I made 60 offers today, and I haven't done anything. Right? Like, what am I doing here? And that's the problem that I have. That's the only aspect I have it now. If you're spending 100k in marketing, and that's, that's fine. But let's be honest, a lot of us on this call right here, don't spend 100,000 in marketing, we got to look at every single lead. This is why I don't believe this is why I don't like to keep it for any carrier making offers every single lead we got to treat it with gold like gold, right? Because we don't have a lot of us that are on here. Don't have that high marketing. What is it a spend of 50 to 100,000? Where we can you know, here's your like this. When you do that offer thing? It's like Anthony is the it's like a slot machine, bro. You put the coin and Okay, Mr. Seller, you get an offer. Alright, you offered shooting. So we don't we don't treat it as a business bro. It's we're looking at it as as a rush like a slot machine right? Now, when it for me when it comes to making the offer, it's I gotta have those three things, right. Sometimes those sellers, they're there. I'm not gonna saying that I don't ever give a number. That's not what I'm here saying. I just don't make it a habit to say, Okay, well, I'm gonna offer you this, or you know, whatever. Some sellers will put you in a position where they won't continue the call, right? Without knowing what you can pay. And there's different positions, different spots where that would happen. A lot of times that happens in the beginning, Hey, I just all all I want to know is how much you would pay. That's all I want to know. I'm not I don't want to you know, you guys have called me you call me. I want to know how much you pay. Always acknowledged what the prospect gives you right? So one thing I always say in that aspect is like, look, that's fair. Anthony, I get it. Yeah, exactly. Right. That's what we call we're looking to buy that property. What I can tell you though, however, is I've never been able to buy a property without asking a few questions. Do you mind if I do that? Right. And now their minds kind of thinking here, right? Like, if and here's, here's the question that's gonna give me two results. Number one, heck, No, you tell me your number. All right, perfect. We're done here. That's not my business. Right? Or number two, they're gonna say that makes sense. So what do you need to know? Okay, perfect. I appreciate that. Do you have like five to 10 minutes, so I can tell you exactly what I need to ask. Getting that advance agreement for them to speak to me, right. That's the first that's the first part most people come out with like, you know, I call it the shotgun approach, right? And make me an offer right now. Boom, right? They hit you, right? Real fast. Like what do you do? Like, 39:08 again, if you don't have a system? Right, Daniel, we talked about that earlier. If you don't have a system, you're going to probably give them an offer. Oh, hold on. Mr. Sir. Let me come. Right, you start copying the property. And then you say, well, it looks like we can pay me to Okay, perfect. I'll call you tomorrow. I'm not sure if I like that. So who benefited from that? You are the seller, seller, right seller? And now you're like, dang, I did all this work. And all this. This is why I have a saying is don't make a move without a commitment. I didn't create that. But I love saying that don't make a move without a commitment. Anytime the seller request for something. I acknowledge it. I'll say I'll get there and I'm going to do it for you. But here's what I need first. So I give them I give them their ask. And then I go to my ask. Now we get down in the conversation where we're talking now. I know I'm uncovering a little bit motive. I know what they want. I know the situation. I know it's affecting them personally. I know that they need to get this done quick but now they don't know how much the price Pretty how much they want to get. There's a couple of strategies that can that you can use, which my favorite strategy is always negotiating from what they owe, or where, what they, what they what their bottom number is. I don't know why our industry always negotiate. Well, let me see what your property is worth. And then I can tell you how much I can pay. I don't know why we do that, and how it's always been. That's how we've been able to get some of the biggest spreads. We've had 300 400 $500,000 months, up to a million dollar month, we've never worked volume company, we were always about profit. And so the way we did that was to negotiate from what was owed, right. So let's say now Anthony, I got do pretty much. And now we're getting into the price, right? Like if I asked you, hey, there's typically Anthony, three things that will stop us from working together. Number one is time number two is price. And number three is other people. Nine out of 10 times they're gonna say price, and we're gonna say all right, perfect. Let's talk about that. Just out of curiosity, I'm assuming this property is paid off. You don't owe anything on it. I'm sorry, right there, bro. I'm not going to what, what? It's what it's owed. Probably seven out of 10 people are gonna say, No, Max, I have a mortgage on this. I have a mortgage on this. Okay, got it. So we know we got to take care of that mortgage. We can't I can't make you an offer lower than that. Just for the record. ballpark. How much is that mortgage that you need to pay? Well, I don't want to tell you that. Well, and he goes, why do you why? Why are you asking that? Or why? Why is that information relevant? I get Anthony, you don't want to give me the information. I just don't want to be in Paris and make you an offer below that because you're gonna hang up on me. Just ballpark. You don't have to be exact. Right? Yeah, so now you're gonna say all right, Max, I owe about 100,000. Perfect. Okay. So we know we got to give the bank 100,000 The bank is not going to say the bank is not going to be like, hey, you know, go ahead and keep that you you and I know that and just above so we got to pay the bank. 100,000 What does that next big like thing? You're going to write a check to what's that amount? I mean, what what else do you have to pay off? Now we're finding out if they owe cars, credit cards. So let's say they have a car we got 100,000 mortgage? You tell me I got a you know, I gotta pay off my car. Okay, just ballpark what is the car? What do you owe on the car? 25,000. So now we got 125. If there's nothing else besides that, then my next question is going to be this is okay, Anthony. So we know we got to pay, you got 100,000 on mortgage, you got the $25,000 that you got it. You want to pay your car off? What do you need on top of that to make you feel comfortable selling the property? We're negotiating from what is owed and what you want to walk away with. Now imagine if I would have done okay, your house is worth this, I need to do this much repairs. I need to be here for profit. Okay, I could pay this. You might say honestly, Max, if you give me 20,000 I can pay off my house on my car. I'm good. And it's a $300,000 house. Right? So that's why that's why I'm a big, I love negotiating from what's owed. And in the other day, I want to say go ahead. Good. 42:50 Fire as fire. Yeah. 42:56 And I've used it consistently, bro. I mean, all my calls the closers if you watch it, like I don't deviate from this process at all. There are going to be people that you're the same. They don't owe anything, by the way, because that's that's an opportunity for seller finance. But in that case, I would say okay, so Okay, so there's no mortgage to take care of? Well, one of the things that I've experienced is usually when people start to think about Lean either the night before as before, whatever that is, they usually have a number in mind, Anthony, do you mind sharing me what that number is and what you were looking to walk away with? Now we don't deal right. Now we're going to find that out again, I want to find your bottom number, bro. Like that's, that's my goal, not what you think your house is worth. So Karnas said, loving this. 43:42 If you do it the opposite way. If you say okay, the house is worth 300, but it needs 50 and repairs and all and you're working down there. And you heard 300. So their brains already up here. But the way you're doing a high number. Yeah. What's What's the what do you what do you need to walk away with you start from the bottom until the A's Yeah. 43:59 Because here's the thing, bro is, here's why I said here's why I do it this way is we do this, depending on your marketing, depending on your business 234 1015 times a month. sellers do this once or twice in their life. Think about that. So what happens is that the number they think that they want is not really the number that they need. That makes sense. The number they think that they want is usually a smoke and mirrors of defense mechanism because you're coming in as you know, a purse somebody's experience, right? Someone that does this, they're over here on their own right like, they this is the house they lived in for 1520 years. Guys, I don't know how many white people have hard time to kind of grasping that right. Like, you're you're that's why that's why people don't realize what they want is not really that numbers what they actually need to walk away with. Right now. Can those numbers be equal? Yeah, of course. Right. Maybe they have a high mortgage and you know they have those have to pay and you're going to be at that number, right? You're going to be at that number that they that they're requesting their thing on this, this will be the last thing for the offer is if someone says, I don't know, I, like make you make me an offer, right? Like, what do you think you can pay for this property? So what I'll do then is I'll have my ma Oh, which is the max allowable offer, right? If I know my max allowable offer is going to be 200,000. Here's the way I'm going to anchor them. If they absolutely need to get a number from me, I'm going to say, You know what, Anthony? Well, let's pretend this I'm not saying I can. But let's pretend if someone was to make you an offer between 175 to 185, what would happen next, if it was net to you no money out of pocket. I know my MA is 200. I'm going to go lower than that. I'm going to anchor it between 175 to 185. Right. That's how I'm making the offer. I never give sellers a hard offer. I always try to figure out what their number because guess what? They're going to feel like they made a decision, they came up with the number. And that's how I'm able to get around people who actually want an offer from me is if I know my Mao is 200,000. I'm gonna go down 20 to 25. And if let's pretend they say well, I can do 175. What if you gave me 190? I mean, I would sell to you right now I'm 10,000 $10,000 lower than what my Mao initially would be. So So again, that's how I that's how I'm able to get around the part of somebody like wanting a number from me, like I need this number. And notice how I said that. And notice how I said that Daniel, and Anthony is, hey, I'm not saying I can pay this kind of trigger monitor routine. But let's pretend someone wants to give you an offer between 175 to one a five. What happens next? I stay quiet, like bite your lip. 46:44 That's super strong dude. And then also giving them a lower range. Right? So you're like, I'm not giving you a solid number. And I'm also not promising you the money. That's another huge thing in sales. 46:53 You're ready for this? 46:54 They want? Yeah. 46:56 So they say oh, no, absolutely, I would never sell. So what were you hoping I would say? Right. So that's going to now give me their their number of what they were thinking. Yeah, like I'm absolutely I'm not saying I could pay that. So but just out of curiosity, what were you hoping to get for it? 47:14 Well, one of the coolest things I love about this, the sales strategy. And like I told Anthony about this when I first went through it was that you always blame the imaginary person next door or the imagining Yes, that's, that's always got the guy down the street, he'd probably give you 150 47:31 Yeah, yeah, always brother always, even internally like, you know, I'm not the one that's actually that comes up with the number never like a Hey, I gotta talk to my friend that my partner, or now now lately we've been using an underwriter because we're doing a lot more seller finance deals. And then what I always tell them is this, like, Hey, I'm gonna go talk to my, let me put you on hold. Or maybe if I set up a callback, I got to talk to my underwriter. It just depends on how the call goes, then I look at it with them. And then And then basically, you know, see if we can if we're able to meet that or potentially pay what you're asking. And then what I tell them is and then I get commitment right before I before I get off the phone, or before I put them on hold as always say, Okay, so I'm gonna go talk to them. So let's pretend I talk to them, and they are able to do what you're asking on the price. And I know it's a good deal. What's gonna happen next, I get commitment, right? I get commitment for them to say, Well, if you guys can do that, I'm definitely I want to sell to you guys. Because that's what I'm asking. Okay, perfect. Now, if we come back a little bit, and this is for set up a call back, right, not on the same call. So let's Okay, so you so we can do the 150 It sounds like you would feel comfortable putting things in writing. And they're like, Yeah, that's what Okay, perfect. Now we don't have an understanding I just want to make sure we understand what's going to happen on this next phone call. However, Anthony if he comes back under under 150, you know, any any offer under 150. I don't give him a number. Notice that if if my underwriter team says we can't do the 150 and they have another number in mind, would you like me to call you back? I'm getting that upfront. They don't have a number. They don't have a number. Right? They don't know what what that number is gonna be as I just said another offer that was it. Right? Would you like No, yeah, yeah, of course. Well, you know, LONG Isn't that Lord like yesterday, I had a guy he wanted 35. And he dropped it to like, like, 20 just on that question alone. He'll Yeah, long as we'll come back lower than 20. And I'm like, Okay. What do you want? 35 Bro, from 35 to 20. And I'm like, me and Ryan. Were looking at each other like, whoa, like 49:34 Yeah, dude, that's super strong, man. I appreciate all those bars, man. That's good stuff. And that's something that you can't learn again by not you know, you gotta have a mentor. You gotta have somebody working with someone has been doing longer than you. And it'll save so whatever you spend on that mentor on that partnership, whatever, it's going to advance you and yours is gonna save you time and it's gonna save you money. So we've covered like systems. When is it time to hire a team to help you grow? Maybe? Okay. 49:59 Yeah, let me ask Some to that because, you know, I do have a masterclass that I actually it's very intimate. I don't allow more than 20 people in that masterclass and, and what I always what I always tell them is like, what what I charged compared to what I paid is like, it's peanuts, bro right to where they're gonna like go through this and it's a three week masterclass like it's not a one day workshop. It's a three week masterclass where they get to, basically, basically get to see the whole system, and they have access to me, they have access to the, they have access to me to book a zoom call, help them, you know, develop the system, put it in play, you know, and potentially help them to get a basically a, what does it call for on a phone call with them? so and so. And I always tell my you guys what I pay, like, it's you guys or it's not even close? Like we're talking about 20 30x of what I charge, right for all your experience that you've built on top of the past the experience. Exactly, exactly. So Leo has, what does Leo say how much? It's 1199 for three weeks? Yeah, so it's not it's not not that high. So and then you get to spend three weeks with me, obviously, it's not the full three weeks every day, but it's every Wednesday. So basically, like the next one is October 26. And we spend about two hours, two and a half hours, we almost got three hours. And we and then basically once it starts, you have access to me and the next Wednesday we meet again, because this allows, you know you've been to the workshops before and the questions don't don't don't happen at the workshop like they happen after right. And so I figured like that was one thing I wanted to correct this is, is I wanted to make sure that I that I'm there with you to ask questions to ask basically anything they need help with. Plus I revamp my script. Our script was like five pages long Now Daniel mine Anyways, my script Yeah, bro. So it breaks. Everything I just told you guys right now is in that script. The one the one I provide? 51:53 Yeah, again, guys, if you're watching this, just for him even offering to help and to give up some of his time, that isn't his time given doesn't compensate the amount of money that you're paying. So I hope people take advantage of that you see the value in it. And once you learn these skills that he just covered right now, because I've been in sales for 20 years. And he just taught me some stuff today on this call. So I can't imagine what else you have back in your toolbox, man. So I'll say this the first person to sign up for for Max's masterclass hivemind will give you $250 towards your towards your high. There we go. Let's do the very first person that signs up guys. So jump on that take advantage of it. And then I see we're getting pretty close to the time and we got about eight and a half minutes left. I wanted to ask you real quick now if we can get into maybe a little bit more kind of advanced for advanced real estate investors. What are you doing now to navigate the coming storm? Right? Because every is like buy, buy save your money get ready to buy. So tell us how you're pivoting into the storm? 52:48 Yeah, you know, we're in a unique position right now. Right? I think, you know, one thing I went to an event I want to say three weeks ago. And in this specific event. What happened is I went to sorry, they had it before, a couple months before, right right before the market started to shift. And I spoken them and they gave me like I wasn't going to speak and they gave me like five minutes. And I just said, Hey, how many of us understand or how many of us know that there's something going on in the market? Right? Brother 600 people there and only like eight people raise their hand. And I said yeah, exactly. Yeah, there you go see? And I said, Wow, I had the microphone like, wow, like eight people when he raised her hand. That's literally what I said, bro. And I said, You guys gotta be kidding me. I said, everybody in this room should raise their hand, everyone. And I said for you guys that didn't raise your hand, I'm going to tell you if you don't pay attention, half of you are not going to be or Morgan not going to be here anymore. And you're going to be working back at your regular jobs. That's what I told them. But let me help you. Then I gave them some tips of how to help them. Fast forward to that to the same event. Right? He always, always got filled up. This was probably three weeks ago, bro. It was literally empty, bro. Like he didn't have half the crowd that was there the last time. So going back to the point we're in some interesting times. And there's there's two types of people right now in this market. They're the ones who came up in the they're the ones who came up in the prosperity time, which was right after COVID Daniel, right. This is when the big boom right? Everything blew up. And you had all these people like the amount of agents that were registered skyrocketed, right? The amount of wholesalers that showed up on the scene and to meetups and all that skyrocketed because right because but they never learned new skills. It was like you can throw a rock and you can definitely you know, get a get a deal and you can sell it the same way. But that's changed, right? You can't do that anymore. Like hey, just lock it up. We'll sell it to you know, whoever they will buy it for 90% of ARV. So going back. Isn't that crazy? How the event story like how that happened? 54:58 Yeah, yeah, it's It shows that the times are changing and like the, like the the agents and like mortgage brokers are all crying right now because like they can't find do any deals and ethics to do marketing. Yeah, exactly. 55:10 So we pivoted a long time ago brother, we basically what we started doing is we started helping other investors through. So basically we started ramping up our JV, nationwide JV partnerships. And so right now, I can tell you that was the first thing we did, right. So what we started doing is we were we're currently working right now with investors nationwide. So on a slow day, we're looking at about three to five deals on a very busy day, we looked at about eight to 10 deals, right. So that was the first thing we did is we started collaborating more that's the other thing is that you have to collaborate a lot more in order to survive like guys with Leo, guys, like you guys like Daniel Anthony. Collaboration is key. It's always been key, but never more than than right now. And the other thing too, is that I've always done it, we've done this but not to a scale where we're doing it now is creative financing, right where seller finance, I think Raphael made a point there about seller financing. It's it's not longer that you that you that you must do it, you need to do it to survive, like it needs to be in your arsenal, seller financing sub two, it has, you got to be able to know how to how to. And again, you don't really know everything, you just got to be coached by the right people, right? Because that's where right now, this is why I said my point about we're in a unique situation. Some of us that know and understand our shifting and pivoting this these times, right, here's where like the wealth transfer starts to happen, right? You've heard that talk, like you've heard people conversate on it. But if you don't know what to do, it's not you're not going to be able to be part of that. So you need to develop new skills, such as right, understanding seller finance, understanding subject to understanding how to pivot, you're going to you're going to need to develop new skills and that's how we've been able to pivot is first collaboration a lot higher, and then and then that's just on the on the outside on the back end. I'm almost like I'm almost a you know, getting with the VAs. I'm actually helping a couple guys like Trenton you know, Stratton Brown, Vic Ada, there's a couple of guys out there that I'm actually working with to help them with some of their leads as well to, to be able to negotiate. So that's again, collaboration, right? Direct to seller stuff, not just joint venture, but the biggest pivot right now what I'm seeing in order to survive this is you got you have to you have to be able to put creative finance into your arsenal. 57:41 Yeah, I mean, I have to talk about all the time, but as interest rates went up, it made it creative finance, like the go to strategies because there's they're anchored at their number with a price point isn't that isn't to me. Something to or, or complete seller finance. 57:57 Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Good. 58:01 It creates a lot of opportunities, especially right 58:03 now. Yeah. 100%. That's, honestly that's, that's really everything that's coming down the pipe right now. I'm seeing everything as as creative finance, like there's no, I'm almost I'm almost like putting creative finance first and then Novation second, and then wholesale. Third, almost now, I'm not even looking at it the deal as a wholesale deal. Can Can might question right away to our JV partners is where the sellers give us time. That's all I want to know. Well, the seller give us time. And I'm learning that from my coach, which is Mike germini. Right? Cash Money, Mike. And that's what that's that's, that's all that's the way he's teaching us. Like just if the seller gives us time, which you know, which is the time to pay whatever they want off. Now we can structure a deal, right? Whatever that is, if it's seller finance or subject to. So every deal that comes in that's that's what we're looking at. We're looking at it through the lens of can we get creative on this because of everything right? Like you got hard money lenders pulling out. I mean, I'm hearing stories like we actually had a deal. I want to say last month too hard too hard money lenders pulled out out of that deal. And then the third one finally ended up funding but that's happening too is we're seeing that some of these hard money lenders are no longer lending the flippers so it's not the flippers are getting like Man, they're getting like crushed right now. In this market. 59:22 Yeah, I think we did the same thing you did, man. When we first started in real estate. It's like we started with creative because we didn't have the funds to buy anything. So we're doing we're doing creative before it was cool. I started uh, I've been talking about that on the calls. I'm like, our first offer has always been creative. Nice. Yeah. And that's just like I said, just dumb luck, I guess. Having the cash on hand. 59:44 Yeah. And the other thing I'm doing too is guys I'm looking at you know, obviously working with with with Mike is I'm actually starting to look at units between six to 20 units. It's kind of a sweet spot. It's a sweet it's a sweet spots where, where people will begin Don't dive into but also the big boys don't want to play in right? These big boys want 50 units and higher right 100 units, which is and here's the great thing about it is that between the six and 20 unit, multifamily apartments, you still have slumlords in there. You still have guys that collect rents cash, you still have a lot of pain, you know, there's not a lot of corporate structure in that area. So there's a lot of great opportunity within that spot that we're gonna go after what states that I don't know yet. I'm going to start on my back. I'm just gonna start here first because I got to get to it. Yeah, I need to understand it, I need to touch it, fill it look at it right before I decide to like do this model virtual because it's a whole nother ballgame, right. And I don't want to be doing a lot of flying, you got to go out and see these properties. You have to walk them, you got it, there's more intel that you gotta gather and all that. So my goal is to start here, this is where I want to start first. And it's not just Phoenix, I can go to Tucson, which is a market south from here. But definitely I want to focus on that because I think there's a huge opportunity right now for that, especially the way the with seller financing structure, and who better who better else to understand, you know, seller finance than an actual, you know, landlord, right, people will get money, cash flow every month. Yep. 1:01:13 We're doing the same thing. And like so we're doing a large scale farm and ranch property. So we only do land, we don't do any other asset class. And yet, we're getting really, really good at Texas. We're locking up a lot of big contracts right around San Antonio. That's where I am. Now we're looking to expand into other states. But yeah, you want to get really, really good at your backyard. So I was asking what is it going to take to partner with you so it sounds like to join your mastermind intensive for about 1200 bucks have my page up for the first person that signs up? What about if somebody has a really good deal? They want to bring you in they partner with you that way? 1:01:43 Yeah, definitely. They can shoot me a message on through through DM definitely a real Maxi menace shoot me a message I answer all my personal DMS I don't have an assistant that does that. I still do it myself. You know, I call people bro, I'll hit them. I'll hit like, let's see if you're real. And I call them like, Oh, man. 1:02:03 I'm telling you guys right now, because I have messaged some of the some of the do ruse, and yeah, there's like a bot like, hey, get on calendar like and so if Max is still willing to talk to you guys right now, I promise you please jump on this opportunity. Yeah, there's gonna be 1:02:17 I'm going there just a little bit, bro. Because I'm being like, super fast. And it's I need to but I still have passion for this. This you know, again, just this is what drives me and I love giving back and I love helping people and and I surround myself with people that are like minded as well, too. So Leo says I'm a talker. My Leo's got my phone number. He never sends me a text. I'm calling you out Leo. 1:02:46 What is a quote that is yours or somebody else's that you resonate with? I know he said a few in this conversation. But what's Yeah, 1:02:53 it's what's in my bio, bro. It's, it's it's Jim Rohn. Right. It says if you want to do something, you'll find a way. If you don't, you'll find an excuse. And I actually would put that on our onboarding docs right at the bottom. And, you know, obviously, when I was in my previous partnership, he was like, do that you go, he would just nod his head like me. It's true. If you want to do something, you'll find a way if you don't, you'll find an excuse. Right? That's really what it comes down to. It's from Jim Rome. Jim Rome, was it to this day, right? Obviously, you pass a wall back, but he's definitely somebody that I consider a high level mentor for me. It's just he's amazing, bro. Like some of the stuff he just, it's very, very relatable even now, even though it was in the late 80s and 70s. very applicable. Very relevant. Excuse me. Yeah, very relevant. And it's amazing that that quote always stood out to me just because of my background who I was. I knew if I wanted to do something I was going to do whatever it takes right to get it done. Even some things probably that put me in a risk a little bit, but I still did it right. Which is other things. Yeah, that's always been my favorite quote from Jim Rome is in that said, I have it in my bio. I put it on our onboarding doc says if you want to do something, you'll find a way if you don't, you'll find an excuse for 1:04:08 it. Which is true. That is beautiful. Man. I love that quote. It's my new favorite quote. I'm gonna get it tattooed right here below both of my eyes. 1:04:19 No, you know what, I don't want to hear jokes. So I would say like, I want to get a tattoo. So I guess I'm gonna show you where. So when someone comes in and starts, like, maybe making an excuse or something, I'll just go like this wrong. I'm gonna put it right here. So they can't see my face. This is gonna be like, you read that? Yeah. 1:04:40 I feel like that too. Like I do. We do help a lot of people. We train a lot of people. We have some paid training. We do a lot of free training coaching for people. Right? Then you'll see the people that really want it. I mean, you'll see them there. They're sending leads are doing and they're putting in the work. You could feel it. You could feel the pressure. They're texting you messaging you like that person is working, where somebody else is like, oh, it's because I've been working a lot and like do the work or Don't do the work don't be in the middle. 1:05:04 That's funny, man. It's true though, man. It's true. Again, going back to original talking about the VA is the, the the preconceived notions and the what's the other word that's used a lot right now is like, like what is it called that attitude of I deserve? What's that 1:05:21 bias? 1:05:22 No, not the bias. But you know, that attitude like, I deserve this, I don't need to work hard for it right? Like, they don't have that. And that's what we're saying. That's why they're getting entitlement. Yes, excuse me, that's the word I was looking for. And that's pretty prevalent right now going on. So that's different from somebody who has a position that they are actually grateful for. And they do it with pride and they do it with you know, with all effort upfront, 1:05:45 I just found out about you that you're you were in construction and I grew up in construction, I did 20 years of construction, like I can, I can build wow, I can build a marble shower as big as a bedroom, you know, and do the dry nice lay in the liner tie in the drain everything and like, I had to really cut my hands and my knees to make 1000 2000 bucks in a week. And now what we're doing with paper and so if somebody has excuses with this business, like man, get out of here, go go. Production or something. 1:06:10 You know, you know what's funny about that is not only that, but I remember like, from from from my teenage years to up to like 21 When I met my wife 22 saved my life. I remember like, dude, all the stupid stuff I did and I'm gonna be scared to make a phone call like, plus all the things that I've been through like, yeah, like this is not this is not hard. And you're right like waking up at 3:30am on in summertime right to start work at 430 or four or five o'clock or whatever, right? And then you know having to do that and yeah, it's do be it tried to be in a ditch when it's 115 degrees. Weather I like that ain't fun, bro. That's hard work. That's really hard 1:06:51 to mix in cement carrying boxes of tile bags of thinset, five gallon buckets of water one 1:06:55 in each Oh yeah. And then you carry the bag and it just rips all over the road and 1:06:59 these brand new houses are brand new buildings that don't have air conditioning right so I'm in a sauna right doing doing concrete and bloodwork carrying this heavy things hurting my back, just to make the grant right so if you send text messages, you can't jump on a phone call like get out of here. Yeah, you're done. Get it? Yeah, 1:07:16 you don't have it. You don't have it. Exactly. 1:07:19 It's sad to save a guy leaving 1:07:22 America bro. Hello. I know. Well, I love it. This has been a great conversation like we covered a lot of different things definitely take some notes somewhere in the middle if you need to go back and rewind that and watch it again. Definitely go watch it again because those those so many like good gems jump on this which is why like Anthony's like a closer but I knew I had to have like the one thing about like talking to high level people is you always can learn something from somebody else. Because they always have some some nugget and like even Anthony's my closer somebody Anthony to be on this call. 1:07:52 Yeah, I appreciate it man. Remember again 1:07:55 to text the text the phone number 1:07:56 so you can text closers closers to 210-972-1842 1:08:02 Maximum right now that he's going to have he has a closing window of opportunity that he's it's going to be less than it's gonna be harder and harder to get a hold of him in the future things moving forward as he continues to scale. So who you can 1:08:13 know 100% I appreciate them and thank you guys for everything you do. And I love it. I love talking today to you guys. I think you know it's always great to give back and obviously again like I told you guys before we started I'm not I don't hold anything back. I just love giving back and that's that's my drive. It's my passion and I like to surround myself with people like that too. 1:08:34 Yeah, man we know that your time has been so we super appreciate you spending time with us. Of course man 1:08:39 semanas and the 1:08:41 IG follow him. Yeah, that guy. 1:08:44 Check it out on IG and then check out his YouTube man when he goes live they'll be telling you if you're just driving around and you don't you're not a reader you're not doing anything else. Throw on his YouTube and all that while you're listening to him close these deals and blow your mind. You'll learn a lot in a very short amount of time. 1:08:58 I appreciate it man. Thank you for that shout out 1:09:01 Well we hope you enjoyed this episode we will check us out on the next episode on the hive is laterra There you go. Have a good day guys. Bye

Max JimenezProfile Photo

Max Jimenez


Max was born in Mexico and was brought to AZ when he was 8 years old with his parents.

He is the first successful entrepreneur in his family to breakout of the rat race!

Max started wholesaling houses in 2015 in Phoenix, AZ which is one of the most competitive markets in the country. Since then he has closed hundreds of transaction with multiple million dollar years in assignment fees.

Max has been involved in sales for over 10 plus years. He has a deep passion for the craft so much that he decided to invest in himself and start training professionally since 2018 which has allowed him to take his skills to another level when it comes to closing.

He’s also inspired hundreds if not thousands around the country to become better at closing through his weekly show The Closers Lab were he makes live calls and teaches people to become better at sales!

Anthony GaonaProfile Photo

Anthony Gaona

Host/ Ceo/ Speaker

Hi! I am Anthony Gaona.
I’ve been in digital marketing for almost 15 years.I grew up in construction working for my dad when I was only 12 years old. Normally we had a ton of work or no work at all so a lot of my free time was spent learning how to generate leads.

It didn’t take very long for me to master online marketing because I became absolutely obsessed with it. For the last 15 years I’ve been generating construction based leads. At first I was running the projects myself. This led to sub-contracting all of the excess projects and eventually wholesaling the leads off to other construction companies.

One day I was preparing to build a single family residence for myself. In mid December, 2018, a simple YouTube search led me to the term wholesaling and the rest is history. The plan was to use my construction background to start flipping houses. By January 1st of 2019 I launched several marketing campaigns both on and offline for real estate seller leads.

Within about 4-5 weeks I had my first real estate contract locked up. It didn’t take long for me get a land lead where I made almost a full year’s pay on a single transaction. This came from a land lead and that forever changed my life.

I ran low volume larger land deals for the first two years of my real estate career. Like anyone who has been in real estate investing for an extended period of time, I started thinking about scaling my business.

Instead of deciding to vertically integrated and start hiring I imagined a model where I would teach my real estate investing methods to others. This would free up my personal bandwidth and allow for unlimited large scale transactions.

Currently our operations are expanding globally. The goal is to identify one person per major US Market that we can build a team around and drive traffic to so we can close high volume transactions together.

You can learn more about our vision and join our free mastermind by joining hivemind CRM on Facebook and all social channels

Daniel Esteban MartinezProfile Photo

Daniel Esteban Martinez

Host/ Ceo/ Speaker

I have been an entrepreneur since 2018. I come from a regular home just like most people. My dad worked on the roads in the Chicago area for over 30 years. He always taught me to work with my brain, instead of my body. Your body can only take so much abuse. I learned so much from my father. He always pushed me to work smarter and not harder.

I have owned and operated a trucking business for 2 years. I started learning real estate in 2019. Fell into the Data & Skiptracing business in 2020. My partner Anthony & I started Hivemind in 2021.

I have done a ton of different jobs coming up from painting, to door-to-door sales, telemarketing, truck driving, and loading trailers. What I learned most is that I want to stay in the digital business space. The leverage you can have delivering digital products to the marketplace can yield limitless possibilites.

I started The List Guys in 2020. It is a data and skiptracing service. We provide seller and buyers list nationwide. My clients have been getting great results and I am proud to help people killing it.

I started the Hive in 2021 with my partner Anthony Gaona. It is a real estate and business mastermind. It also comes with a all in one CRM, that can host unlimited websites and users.

Starting the Hivemind has been an amazing journey so far. Seeing one of our users make his 6 figure month in June 2021 leveraging our software, I know there will be plenty more to come!