Hey, we're here today with Axl my ossifer from northern Germany, but no longer there. But he's out of San Diego. We're gonna talk about that we're gonna have a conversation today. I love how I love talking to new people and learning new things just because I'm I'm a sponge of information I like I like acquiring new information. So I like talking to people that have been doing things for a long time and have the experience to because they have they got experience. So first question I always start off with is how did you get into real estate? And if you want to, you can even mention how I ended up in the United States since you're from Germany to actually that's interesting story. Yeah, absolutely. Okay. Well, maybe we start with the second part first, how do we, I was in the Air Force in Germany and found out because I was in aircraft testing, you know, so we first got the training, and then started flying. And then I found out that I was testing and I got into testing. And part of that is when these black boxes that they put in the planes, most of them are made or used to be made by American companies. So if you are in testing, and you want to basically help to integrate one of those boxes into the plane that you're flying, you have to go to the company, because there is no place where you could get training other than from the company itself. So my wife and I, and at the time, that tiny little baby daughter, we came over to the US to different locations at these companies. Basically, the deal was I go for like four weeks of training sitting in a classroom most of the time and daughter and wife go shopping, and beach and pool and stuff like, and most of these places were in Texas and California. So most of the time, good weather and so forth. And the question became is, is there a way to maybe do this for a longer period of time, especially as long as our dollar is too small. And I looked at it and found out there is actually an exchange program between the US Air Force and the German air force I applied, was very lucky to be chosen for that, and then came over to join the US Air Force unit in New Mexico. And that was supposed to only be like two, maybe three years and ended up being more than six years. And by the time I had created a lot of relationships. So when I said okay, well, I'm getting to the point where you can no longer fly for physical reasons, just because it's too demanding. And I don't want to stay in the air force without flying. But if I wanted to stay in the US, I need somebody to sponsor me for like a green kind of job and all that kind of stuff. And there was a company in Santa Barbara that said, Yeah, we take you we love you, we want you. So I didn't even I was stupid enough to not even really take a vacation. So we basically turn in the uniform it like first off the next month, started the new job, did that for a couple of years and then realized, I would like to have the opportunity to be in charge myself. Right. I've basically followed other people's orders for all my life pretty much you know, first in school and then in the airforce, and pretty much in that software company tool. And I started my own consulting business. But that brought up the question, okay, well, if you run a business, will you do this for the rest of your life? Or is there ever a point where you can basically either diabetic or retire? And I thought, well, what can I do now? Keep in mind, I started that in 2005 and 2000 to three, the stock market kind of blew up. Yeah, so that wasn't really an option that I started looking around. And I always say the funny part is funny, I find it firstly, still funny. I was like, Okay, so who could I look to who would be somebody who could give or have some some inspiration? So for some strange reason that must have been at the time where that was one of those big Terminator movies and stuff like that going on. So it became like, Okay, I wonder what he does with all the money he's making? I looked into it and you know, most people probably don't know but at the time and beyond that in property search today he is one of the largest real estate owners in California because use a lot of his money and bought real estate well, okay, I thought well, you know, he's an immigrant. Yes, Austria, not Germany, but close enough, right? And yes, making money and investing in real estate and then he became governor, which was crazy. So I thought well, you know, let's see if this is actually something for real only for rich people and started learning about and then started investing a little bit and you know, I was still in the military getting moved around. And I had seen several times that sometimes you rent, sometimes you will live on base, sometimes you buy something, so it wasn't completely strange. That's how I got into it. And at some point I started this is kind of my personality, I guess, you know, initially it was okay, this is an option and then I really wanted to find out and I dug deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper and ultimately kept telling people stories about and they said oh, you should put this out there. You should go to the website. You should do this and that and it took quite a while but it 2019 I said, Okay, I think I have enough experience I feel comfortable helping other people and now we can do that and, and then Mr. Pandemic came along and gave me more time. So you know, so ever since been basically doing idea with grow and really enjoying it. It's an amazing story. So I love that you brought up Arnold too, because Arnold, I heard I heard something about Arnold too, is that he was actually he bought like a four unit before he even became an actor. And he made a million dollars just on that four unit before he even became a Hollywood celebrity. So there's a lot of interesting stories that come along with that. And him. He bought that basically with money from bodybuilding. Yeah, I mean, most people don't know that he was a very buff guy. But like, if you were to separate, you know, first life, Second Life third life, the first life was bodybuilding, all of the universe and all that and he became a professional bodybuilder partnered up for some nutritional supplement stuff. And that man, that's the first part where he did what you just said. And then he went into acting, you know, he was recruited into acting. If you watch, if you go on YouTube, and look at any of the very early like the barbarian, you would never think that he would actually become the first he became so moronic, like, I don't know if they just cast him that way. But us barbarians are rough movie. Right? I mean, he's super buff, but I mean, acting is not. Not the the big thing in it. But you know, and then he had a political career. So and that's an amazing story. It's a it's an amazing story. But let's let's kind of jump on your story. So one things I love about is that you kind of you you wanted to learn more about it. So let's talk about that. What are some resources to learn more about 1031 Exchange? And like those preliminary thought processes of creating wealth? Like is there books, podcasts recommend? I know your podcast hosts too. So I'm sure you probably allude in that too in your podcast? Yeah, we talking about in the podcast, although i i bring people onto the podcast, trying to give a little bit of a variety because one of the things that I learned, the big underlying lessons is you have to initially identify what are you going to be comfortable with as the area area or some people used to call it a niche that they really wanted to get in deep, right? Because you can do storage units or apartments or flipping or I mean, a million different things. So for me that that was an important thing. So I used to have it in the background. I don't think it's there anymore. I saw a book called turnkey revolution. Okay, which helped me a lot because Chris closure is one of the founders of what is now called Rei nation, but they used to be called Memphis invest, because they started out as a company that did turnkey in real estate, residential real estate in Memphis, and then spread from there. But what Chris did really well, as he described in the book, what are all the things that you want to be aware of and check into and make sure that they're in the right way and right place? If you intend to do turnkey investing? The first step is to say, Okay, I want to be in residential real estate, rather than any of the other things. And if you then say, residential real estate, and you're in Temecula, I'm in San Diego, we know, we're talking about 678 $100,000. What if you say, Okay, how can I invest into that, with a normal investment approach of 20%? Down 80% Finance? Well, if you take your five $600,000 house, that's 100,000 120,000 $50,000 downpayment. Now, at least I have to say most of the people that I work with, they don't run around with that kind of money in their back pocket, and a percent, but that basically means you have to go somewhere else, which is the whole turnkey idea is to say, if I find an organization who does the things that I if I were close enough, or to myself, then I can work with them, yes, they get a little bit of money for their work is fair. But I can invest in properties that I would otherwise be way too far away from to ever get involved with. And that's kind of the turnkey model. And so initially, when people consider working with me, or joining our little tribe, or anything like that our heifer should probably see, in this case, that's the determination to say, okay, is this particular approach where we invest in residential real estate from single family home to four Plex? And that's it. Yeah, with partners where we can find properties that really perform not just any property, but a property that serves the purpose of making us cashflow. That's the thing you know, so are you taking more of like a management opportunity with a with a partner With the with the person that has the money that wants to move it, or what's your position on that. But an idea, let's go on the thing that we are currently offering, we're working on doing something in addition, but right now we're offering basically mentoring, which means I call that taking somebody by the hand, and it's almost, if we weren't, you know, like on Zoom, we would literally kind of do this in a way for finding out what do we want? Is this the right approach? And let's just say for a moment, yes, residential real estate and the turnkey model is the right approach. Now I'm opening up my network to the turnkey providers, then I invest with the insurance providers, I use the blenders that I use kind of on the order and all the people because like I said, I started this in 2005. And so over all these years, developed a lot of relationships. And it's always if Daniel Martinez says, hey, I want to join AXA. And I say, Hey, Eric, I have Daniel Martinez, he's one of my highest members. Can you help him get the property that we saw on your website, it's a little different than if you just surf around and you find the property and you say, Hey, I'm Dan. And I want to see if this property is for me, because there is no connection. Yeah, doesn't change the property, but it changes the relationship right from the get go. Right. And so yeah, that's basically how it works. And the thing that we are working on to add, because you can imagine this hand holding is not scalable to 1000s of people. So one thing I want to add, is kind of like an online program where people can kind of learn and see what we do, until we have the next open slot. And then they can start using that knowledge. And everything else is obviously then constantly available to everyone to actually get into the activity of investing because most people, I really have to say most people that we working with, they haven't done a whole lot of deals yet. Yeah, they're there, they might have stopped their nine to five job they might behind murderers, they might be just that that person bring in a lot of Right, exactly. Yeah. And I mean, the philosophy from from the idea of it from our perspective is to say, I like to first coach and mentor you to find out number one, is our approach suitable for you? And if that's a yes, what is your time freedom point number, how much cash flow on a monthly basis do you want to actually accomplish so that it covers all your costs and expenses of your regular daily life as it is today? And when we know what that is, what that number is and where you are right now we can make a plan, which I call the journey of what do we need to do step by step to reach that point that milestone? And if you imagine for a second we reach that milestone that is the time on the calendar, when that cash flow passive income comes in every month. And then you have the freedom to say, Okay, do I want to keep my job? Do I do half my job? Do I do something that doesn't pay but I love it or anything like that. Because if you think about it, from that moment on from that time freedom point moment, you will probably still next year, increase the rent on a few of your properties. And that is almost 100% more in your pocket, right? If you have a situation where you say, Okay, I'm making, let's say $4,000 cash flow a month. And the government says we have 8% inflation. And then you say, okay, 4,008% 10%, it's about roughly 400 $350, I have 10 properties, I only need to increase my rent by $35 Each, which is reasonable. And I have the money. So inflation i Okay. Yeah, this is gonna be true forever, right, basically. So that's, that's what we're trying to do is get people to first determine is it the right approach? Do we like it to be one to do it? And then what's the journey to get to the first milestone? So and you made a really good point early on as far as California being a good cash flow market? So what markets are you in currently and what markets do you recommend to go into as far as to find good properties that make sense to get the cash flow while we were in, in Idaho, Illinois, Ohio, Florida, Alabama. We looked into Missouri, but never did it. And I'm right now at the edge. Almost there to maybe do something in Texas. I've always resisted Texas for the property taxes, but I'm also aware of the economic development and you know, so we could probably overcome the property tax situation they have the with the right deal, so I don't have it yet. And I'm always for any one of those things. I think it's an important distinguishing factor is I always want to do these things first myself. Yeah. Quickly example, I have found out that there is a way a path to do the turnkey model internationally. And I'm somebody who cares about the environment. So I found an organization in the Caribbean that offers eco friendly tiny houses. When new in the turnkey model. Wow. I said, Okay, I gotta try this myself with my money. And if it all works the way I think it should, then I can open it up to our hive, tribe, our hive. And I found out, these guys don't have to hash it together. Now, I'm still gonna get the house. But I don't want to expose any of my mentoring clients to the pain that I've already gone through. And can it be fixed? Yes. Would I be happy to help them this organization to fix it? Yes. But until it's fixed, I would never refer anyone into that. There's a there's a lag with certain upcoming markets. Like there's even when I'm really I'm really glad you're saying hi, because that's we call our group our group is the highest. So it's kind of cool. You're using the hive as the as your little name here. But one of our clients, he's doing print, he's doing the 3d printed house, he bought the chain for 3d printed house, and he's looking for land to build that, like it's still early on. But it could be it could easily change. And so do tiny homes, like it's still too early on. And a lot of people in that niche haven't necessarily found their footing yet, whereas single family multifamily, they have their strong footing, where that their things their their process, process in general already set in stone. Like their thing. It's all set in stone. 100%. So the and even Airbnb is finding their footing, I think the abundance, they're still in the midst of funding and flooding. Where's it going with this? Oh, I was going with this. As far as I'm really glad you're testing out the market, because the market can easily sway in different ways. And it might take a couple of years for those special specialized niches to find their footing in how they actually do their, their, their business in general. Because there's always people that the big, they're trailblazers, they create the path, but they're also creating problems behind them that usually they're fixing themselves, or people have to deal with them behind them. So I commend you on that part. Thank you. I mean, the thing part about it is for one, I want to check it out myself. But there's also a component of expectations and preparation. Oh, yeah. So when I can say, Okay, well, there is this opportunity, after I've actually gone through the whole thing and the house has been paid. And I can see that the renting and management and stuff works. I mean, as you said completely correctly, it's going to be probably 1518 months before I can actually even say, Yep, this is where we are. And this is maybe the point for somebody to consider. But there's a difference. If I say, hey, Danielle, there is going to be a pretty painful process to even just setting up a bank account and getting a business set up. But if we don't do that, we can use financing. If we can't use financing, then the deal is not nearly as juicy as it would otherwise be. Now, if we do the financing, its international financing is more expensive than in the US. And the paperwork is at least as horrible if not more so horrible than what we're used to. So if I said all these expectations, and then these things happen, and even if they happen a little better, a little smaller, it's expected. If on the other hand, I'm just saying, Okay, why is the same thing like to any dealer in Ohio, and it's not, then obviously, it's not just a matter of reputation, it's also people get frustrated. And any kind of when your own money isn't worth, that anything that has your money and frustration, those two things should ideally stay away from each other. And so that's part of the reason why I'm why I want to always first figure it out. And that doesn't mean that things never go wrong. But if you've done it a bunch of times, and you have built a relationship, and you're seeing what can happen and so forth, and it's a little easier to handle. Yeah, there's a there's a there's a saying it's like when you once you put your own money into it, you're gonna pay attention a lot more. Know. Exactly, exactly. And the thing is, what what that misses is if you know where to pay attention, right, kind of my role as a mentor to say, okay, yeah, million things that you could look at, but the important ones are these five. Yeah, that's good. How do you feel about Airbnb ease? Because I think a lot of what you're doing is rentals. Have you dabbled into Airbnbs at all as far as getting cash flow for that? Yeah, I do. And I like it. I like the idea like the fundamental approach, but again, if the strategy holds, which I believe it does, under this understanding of turnkey, then you want to have to stay with Airbnb terminology, a professional suppose. Right? Because again, if I find a property let's just Take an example I find a nice four bedroom two bath property in a suitable Airbnb location for $200,000. Just as an example, yeah, it's probably not going to be where you and I live. Yeah. 100%. Right. So that means we are at the same point. Now, it's not just the regular residential property management company. Now, I need somebody who does Airbnb superhosts kind of property management. And I do this, I'm very fortunate to have somebody who does that for me in certain market. And obviously, what your audience might be interested in, you've got to be willing to give this organization 25 to 30% of your income of your of your revenue. Yeah. Why? Because anybody who ever looks at okay, how does the marketing how does the engagement How do I become a super host for any kind of Airbnb or VRBO offering is based on engagement and activity, and it's way off the charts more than compared to like collecting the rent once a month for years and years and years. And every once in a while taking a maintenance call. It's a whole nother job. Yeah, it's a whole different thing. But if you say, I want to be, on the one hand, Daniel Martinez, the king of the Martinez investment Empire, but I'm the king, the king doesn't do the work. Yeah, right, or the queen for that matter to you know, so if somebody is the king or the queen of the Empire, which is part of what I'm trying to get my my members and my tribal members, my five members to get to is not just be an investor, I want you to be the king and the queen of your empire, which means we're setting up an LLC, we are helping you to get a will and a testament not that I'm doing it, I'm just pointing them just like I do, for the investments to all the relationships I had with that for estate planning for having an LLC to ultimately turn it into a series LLC to have an operations company to have tech support to have documentation support all those pieces. So you can say I'm the king Danya. And everybody is doing their thing, that at the end of the day, it makes Ching and money comes into the bank account. And so that in this Airbnb or short term rental approach, I'm totally for it. As long as we have the right kind of people, which is basically to an organization's is true for for all the other pieces too. In that sense. I'm basically proposing short term rental in the turnkey model. That's good, that's good. I really liked that you even bring up estate planning. No one thinks about estate planning, no one that like it only thinks about it until like they're there. They're in like, there might be a diagnosis, something that I think about estate planning. It's not necessarily in the forefront of people's minds, because it's not I mean, it's some maybe it's something you don't want to you don't want to think about. But it's something that needs to be done once you start acquiring assets. So that's that's even huge in itself. Because that I mean, once you get to a point where you're start acquiring assets, you got to think of what happens after you're gone. For everybody. This is why I actually put that point earlier. Yeah, yes, you're right, that you want to think about what happens after you're gone. But take my example is, let's just say you're on the journey to your time freedom point. And you have five or six properties, each one varying between 150,200 in value, that's, you know, you put your 20% money, and that's the value of these properties. So if Daniel Martinez were a lawyer, and somebody comes and says, Hey, Dan, I fell down the stairs of access house Modenese house, and I think it is for the STS. Illegal to that. They go a little bit on the public records and say, oh, man, this Daniel Martinez guy has a million and a half in assets. That's juicy, I always get 40%. If I win the case, let's do that. So often disguised. Yeah. Versus they look up and say, we can't even find that this guy owns anything. And after a little more digging, we find Oh, yeah, he finds Texas for his operating company. Well, if they're really good, they might find out, okay, this operating company owns a bunch of other businesses. That's about it. And if they go and Sue anyway, just based on the address of the property, and that's one of your 150 or $200,000 properties, even in this super unlikely case that it just says, yeah, it's Danny's fault. But then you say, Okay, well, the business just went out of business to places done $150,000 loss, but the rest of you million yesterday or two or three? Yeah, that's, you know, and you don't have to die but you can get sued, especially in our society. nowadays. You don't want to wait until somebody says, How much does this guy have that I could siphon off and make him bleed? No. You want to have a structure where any point putty is only vulnerable for itself and not everything that anyone's Are you recommending trust? While it depends you can some people, I believe you can do a series and let's see. But like in California, for example, you have to do a Delaware trust. And the way I recommend you do it is have your assets, the real assets, managed by an operations company as one construct, and have your family trust as the second contract, construct. And then there's something called alignment, where you align your basically what your business operations are with your family trust. Good stuff, right there. Good stuff. Now, I hope I hope people definitely set yourself up with your your estate planning, man, but so important. It's so important, especially to get assets so important. Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, one thing that I find is that there is an evolution, right, like you want to evolve your mindset to become king, then, or Danya, or king material. So that's a mindset part to say, Okay, I am actually sitting on this thing, I'm in charge. Right? When you ask me, how did we get here, I said, one of the things when I was working for the software company was this notion, I want to be in charge of my life, my income, my activities, my outcomes. Well, you can have a full time w two job doing your thing for someone, and at the same time bidding with our head, for example, to be in charge of your money. How do we make your money work for you, with the assets that ultimately sustain not only you when you get your time freedom point, but the rest of your family forever and ever. My dad's kind of like the the aspect. And being in charge of that, even if you spend currently a bunch of time off of your time for a job, the one that enables the other sooner or later. Right, that's kind of the mindset part that is important to me. And part of that is then okay, if you get in charge of what you do with your money, then you want to get in charge of the structure, in charge of the taxation, protect yourself from lawsuits, all those kinds of things. It's not all at once. It's an evolution. That's why I call it a journey. We don't start with a massive estate protection plan when you have no assets. But as you start adding and finding them and adding them, we also in parallel builds your empire in that sense, and your mindset, whether that's good. That is good. That's that's a, it's a it's an ad learned with business to businesses. It's a, like I said, it's a step by step. So it's a it's a ladder. So problems you're dealing with. Now they only get bigger and worse as you get bigger. And as you get bigger and do more revenue. And they don't go away. They just get bigger. Are they giant? Yeah. And that's why I say, you know, as your empire grows, you're gonna get more people to do it for you. But it's not very common that the king is actually becoming agenda is becoming that account. No, it's becoming the Secretary of State. And you want to always make sure if it gets bigger and takes more of my time, I need more people, but not take off the crowd and do it yourself. Let's, here's, here's a question leading up to that. How do you find good people? One of the things that helps is good interviewing skills. Okay. And I don't know where it actually comes from, or why this has evolved. I'm originally from Germany, a big proponent. If you think of how did this work in the past, in Europe, it's very common to have what they call an apprenticeship model. Okay, so somebody says, hey, you know, I like real estate, and I want to do something in real estate, just as an example, could be any other profession. And so I tried to find a master, who is giving me a chance to be an apprentice. And during your one to a three year apprenticeship, it turns out, you find out for yourself if this is the right thing, you find out if you can actually master the skills that are necessary. And then as you get better and better you actually earn permission to teach other apprentices. What we seem to have done is to say, let's get rid of all of that, and just have a 30 minute interview to determine is Danny, the right guy. And I would submit, I don't think you can figure this out that fast. Right? So I use a tool and if people are interested, I had the author to develop it. The author is Don Mariska and he wrote a book called Take charge of your talent. And in the back part of the book, it has got what's called the guided conversation mistake. Questions that determines and can help you to determine is the person that I'm talking to suitable for what I'm looking for. But then only as the foundation, right, you want to say somebody who is actually working for me is suitable for this job. If somebody, for example, is telling you that they need a side gig for a little while, because they need to get enough money together to achieve goal ABC, and you're looking for somebody that you want to bet your business with for the next three to five years is probably not a good fit, has nothing to do with the character dedication or anything like that. Your goals don't align. Yeah, so that is just a simple little example. So on the one hand, the quick answer is interviewing. But it's not just have a conversation, then think of how you feel. It needs to be deeper and more involved in that and get basically a person to agree to say, Okay, well, if we agree that we want to work together, let's do this for 90 days and see how it goes. Right. And there is there is one thing that we don't use in communication nowadays very often anymore is around your place. Yeah, used to be very common. And now you're almost not allowed to use that term anymore. But I really like it because I say, if somebody wants to work with me, and I have people working in the Philippines with me, but for years, because they I offered them to really learn all kinds of things, because I'm the guy to find the founder, the King, I need to guide my my people to what I want from them, what kind of Kingdom do one, right, but giving them that opportunity and they and applying themselves, they will find and they try? I mean, I've seen this, they didn't tell me but I've not initially, but afterwards, I said, Well, you know, I wanted to have a few more hours. And I tried something else. And I'm now ashamed to tell you that I did this, but I should have asked you if I can get more hours because that really sucked. But okay, well, then you went fell in the trap of what most people do. Now, that also means for anybody listening, you want to get clear about how do you lead and guide other people? If you want to be the kingdom, that is not just you doing all the work by yourself? You have to think a little bit about that, too. Right? So are they suitable? Do they have the right skills? Are they willing to basically prove themselves for a little while? And can you actually guide them into the things that you need them to do? And when that fits, you can rinse and repeat over and over and over again. And this is this is a that was really mean that was really in depth. I hope everybody got value from that. Because in my mind, I'm thinking about all my employees I've ever had since I've been a boss and like, I'm like listening to you and like man, I really need to that was that was that was that was really, really good. He was really not me. See, the thing is I use analogies a lot. And I would say if you want to have somebody on your team, for a good while, yeah, just like going out and get ice cream. You really need to want to know who is this person? And what does this person bring to me? Is it really a good fit. And I believe oftentimes too many cases, people treated as if they go on and want to just recruit get some ice cream, then they're disappointed that the flavor was wrong. Man, this is such a great conversation. And I said even when we talked about the beginning, this this part here is really, really in depth. So I love podcasts. Right here, this conversation right here. Key key key conversation points are here. I love I love the experience you have. It is amazing. Because like one thing, one thing I'm very aware of like I've been I've been entrepreneur for years, and I'm still young, I'm still very young, and I take it as I operate myself differently depending on who I'm talking to. But I always like I'm always looking for information because there's explain years of experience that I don't have to ask you about I can hear it, I can hear the experience coming from you. And it's it's very, very good to hear because a lot of people man, they just they think they know it all. And they don't absorb that information. They just don't it rolls off the rolls off the shoulder. But me I'm like, Man, this is I'm taking it all in because it's all it's all good information. What makes me a better leader is by listening to people that have been where I have been. And that's what makes him better linear, a better listener, a better interviewer, a better boss, a better manager. All this stuff culminates into you as entrepreneur and you have to take it all in every facet. Because as a solopreneur you're doing everything you're the you might be the accountant, you might be the sales, you might be the CEO, you're doing all this, all those jobs. But as you get bigger and more organized, you have to hire and fill those gaps wherever you're lacking. And that's the point of evolution of becoming a vet. entrepreneur as a boss 100% Yeah, I totally agree. One. One thing I'd like to add, if you don't mind is for that for that leadership role or role as a leader. I really strongly, strongly believe and I've found that most people, when they really honest with themselves would have to say there is room for improvement. And I'm even saying this about myself still to this day is we need to learn to ask way, way more questions. If you ask yourself, if anybody's listening and you say, okay, where would I fall on the spectrum as the ability to lead? You should be about 70 to 80% questions and the rest answers and explanations and stuff like that. I'm sometimes they are sometimes not. But I'm also worried, right? Like you properly identified. But I didn't say hold though. No, no, I know, I know what I mean, it's not that hard. I did 22 years of Air Force than I did five years of software company, and I started my business in 2005. You add it all up, you know where you are, right. But the point is, getting to this aspect and getting to really being a leader means you have to ask a lot, and hopefully very good questions. If you catch yourself that it's like 5050, that means you're telling people way too much detail. Right? Or you're basically taking way too many things on yourself. Because questions means you are looking for answers you're not giving it. And so I always recommend for people I do like leadership, mentoring, coaching, still a little bit in my consulting business. That's one of the tricky things to learn. And then also, you don't want to always only have one question at the tip of your tongue, you know, you need to develop that skill that master on how can I ask insightful, interesting questions. So that people want to be part of the conversation and revered stuff, or solutions and ideas and creations and whatever else it might be that help the business, for example. But that's an important thing. When you say, you know, what I want to evolve as a leader is spend a good amount of time learning and developing the muscle of more questions, like questions. What's crazy about the St. Louis say about that? I feel like podcasting has really opened my mind because I'm not active listening to ask that next question. And like a lot of these things I don't I don't come into the scripted. I don't have a list of questions I asked. I have like five or so questions I might ask you about the interview. But a lot of it is just free flowing off of the give and take of the conversation. So I feel like I've gotten I exercise that muscle a lot better. And I don't know, I feel like I'm getting better as it goes. But I enjoyed doing this because I'm always learning new stuff anyway. And even techniques, it's a good experience a good exercise. Absolutely. And there's actually there's a guy named Ron Heifetz, you wrote a really good book about leadership and a little little image that he put in there that I like and keep using. And it might be interesting for your audience as well is, if you imagine, general day to day as a play on stage in the theater. And one of the skills both with asking more questions, but also in general, to see what's going on is the ability to go what's called the meta perspective or Ron Heifetz called, go to the balcony of the CNN theater, stand at the balcony, look down at the stage with yourself in the play, and see what you see from their eye. Because when you are in the in the play, you only have a certain perspective, if you can go to the meta perspective and see the whole play, you can oftentimes see things that you don't recognize or see when you are in the play itself or your mind is focused on in the play. And for somebody in a leadership role, or the king of the Martinus Empire or something like that. That is an important skill. And ideally, if you really evolve your skill, you want to be able to be in the play. And every once in a while to kind of build this ability to go to the medical perspective and try to see what's happening, why you're also moving in the play. And if you can do that, then you can start anticipating what should be the next step that I'm taking as part of this play of life going on. Perspective? Perspective is powerful. That's, that's good. That was a good one. perspective, man, my mind my mind is going this is such a good conversation. What is a quote that is yours or somebody else's that you that you resonate with? Well, I don't know if it's a quote, I've always used it as a slogan is helping others Jim says become successful, helping others help themselves become successful. The one things I've learned, as I've noticed is that you can't help everybody. Right? You can't help everybody. And I think it's one of the one of the beauties of interviewing before you talk to people. Because if you can eliminate those people that you can't help from the beginning, there's no false expectation that you offered in their mind, because you already eliminated them from the get go, like, Hey, I don't think it's gonna work out. You're absolutely right, it's actually an additional that a thing that can help you in that is, if you can switch your mind from assuming that you have a solution that everybody needs or wants to offering a solution where people can self identify that they resonate with it, and that they want to be part of it. That we're eliminate so so so many, that you think you need to engage just to find out that it's not for them, and allows you to focus on those who actually aligned with what you have to offer. Good, this is good. We're gonna get marketing people, by the way, hate that, right? Because we are led to believe that social media and marketing there is billions of people out there, so you will never run out of customers. Yeah, well, in truth, you will never run out of leads, but leads and customers, right? So if you can get to a point where you say, Okay, I do a podcast with Daniel Daniels audience listens to it, there might be 5000 people out there, and three or four say, Wow, that is exactly what I'm looking for. Well, then I don't need to talk to the other 4900 they might learn something from our conversation. But the important thing is who self identifies to say, that's what I've been looking for. Just getting it's a numbers game at that point, and getting in front of enough people that I mean, at the end. So at some point, you will say, hey, actually, how can those who self identify you don't say it in those words, but I would say, those of our audience who self identify after listening to this, if anybody feels the urge to get in touch, what do they do? And I would say why don't you go to the idea of escort.com. And in 30 seconds, something pops up to say, Click here to schedule a call with Axel and see if what you felt during the podcast is also true after the podcast. You go ideal westpro.com That's on Facebook, Instagram. And the website I deal with tor.com. Right. Exactly. I know when he pops up on the on the website with the scheduling link, but yeah, exactly. That's, that's really good. Man. I really appreciate your time. I know we covered a lot in this call from the 1031 to leadership and man. There's a lot that we covered. I really appreciate your time. I appreciate you giving your information will be because I appreciate it. And like I said, I do I don't do these calls. I don't do these podcasts for everybody else. It's more of a selfish matter. I do it for me, because I like getting getting the information firsthand. Yeah, absolutely. That's cool. And see maybe I was able to help you have your server become successful. There you go. We appreciate your time. Thanks for coming on, man. I hope people find value and reach out to deal wealth grower.com Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you.